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Adrift
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Hey folks,

Been sort of lurking the board a bit, thought I'd drop in and say hi. I had heard about Lexx for a number of years, and I knew it had a bit of a cult following, but had never had the opportunity to catch an episode until I found the whole series on Hulu. I watched the first movie of series one and thought it was interesting, but didn't get into it again until about a week ago when I decided to give the second movie a spin on Netflix. From there I was hooked. I'm currently on about the 3rd episode of season 3, and I'm a bit upset that it won't be long till I run out of episodes.

Season/series 1 is really what blew my mind away, and so far very few episodes have really matched the all out zaniness and creativity I saw in those first 4 movies, but there are enough real gems in season 2 to keep my attention throughout.

There are a few Lexx forums online, but I was sort of drawn to this one because it still looks semi-active, and the board has an outdated, sort of lo-fi late 90s feel to it that really matches the series in some way. That's not a knock on the site, by the way, thats a compliment. :D

Okay, I think that's all for now.

Abby1964
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Welcome to the site.

Kaden
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Bienvenue! :bounce_pinka:

Season one is my favorite, too. The rest are good, and even had some brilliant episodes, but they can't top the films.

Jensau
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Helloooo!!

The films are special, but there are quite a few gems dotted throughout the rest of the seasons and chances are, you'll have a lump in your throat when you reach the end!!

Angel
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Mana: 
Welcome aboard. The films are the foundation and the episodes the topping, some really good ones, some filler ones, but it's all good.

Ketana
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There are 'other' Lexx sites? really? whoowuda thought it...

Adrift
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Thanks all for the warm welcome!

Yeah, the films from season 1 are just spastic. What drew me to the series (and I'm sure this is probably true for many others) was the pure weirdness of it all, and its strange that it took me till episode 2 to really appreciate that fact. Season 1 and certain episodes of season 2 remind of those early issues of the sci-fi magazine Heavy Metal in that there's a very, sort of, other worldliness about this series that conventional sci-fi rarely ventures into. Maybe the closest parallel in my mind is Outer Limits or something.

There are certain aspects of the show that I'm not a big fan of. I think a lot of the script work is subpar, and the acting is sometimes a little stiff (that could be due to the just plain bizarreness of the script and a lack of proper direction though), and even in a no boundaries sci-fi show like this, reasonable suspension of disbelief is strained to its limits. I'm also not the biggest fan of in-your-face slapstick, but this is all made up for by the pure innovation of the series' concepts especially as pertains plot lines, character concepts, and the set designs and FX on such a limited budget. The amount of sexuality and gritty/goriness for a sci-fi tv series is also an interesting draw. You just don't really see that, at least, not in the US.

I'm up to episode 4 of season 3 now, and its a very different show in some ways. I like that they toned down the slapstick, and the plot is far more linear which is nice. Its not just 3 people in a ship waiting for something crazy to happen. But it seems to be evolving into more of a standard sci-fi series in a lot of way. Character reactions to unfolding events don't seem as fluid as they ought to be either. That's something that's always been a bit of an issue in previous seasons, but it seems more noticeable to me now. Xenia Seeberg's hairstyle change is also a bit distracting. I mean, the red wig she was wearing in season 2 looked a bit silly sometimes (oddly the first few episodes her hair looked more natural... at some point it got crazier looking, a similar thing happened with Eva Habermann's hair between season 1 and 2), but it sort of defined the look of her character. Her new doo looks great, but I'm just not used to the change yet... she looks like she got a tan too.

It sort of sucks that I didn't catch this series during its original heyday. Each time I watch a new episode I want to talk to other people to get their take, but there's no one really to do that with anymore, and I'm nervous that I might see too many spoilers if I get online and check out what other people think... Ah well. :D

By the way, this is something I think about every time I see Stan... does anyone else think he's the spitting image of the French actor Dominique Pinon. He's the actor who often collaborates with directors Jean Jeunet and Marc Caro. Folks here may know him from City of Lost Children, Amelie, and Alien 4 (though only the last one isn't in French).

Angel
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Mana: 
Ketana wrote: There are 'other' Lexx sites? really? whoowuda thought it...
You mean there's others? Where in the HELL have I been?  *scratches head*

Abby1964
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Mana: 
Angel wrote:
Ketana wrote: There are 'other' Lexx sites? really? whoowuda thought it...
You mean there's others? Where in the HELL have I been?  *scratches head*


LOL! I was kind of feeling like we were the Bates Motel of LEXXdom. Kind of the only business left open on some old 2 lane highway that nobody uses anymore unless they live in the area.

Hmmmm Think I'll avoid the shower!:c030a:

Ketana
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Mana: 
Abby1964 wrote: Angel wrote:
Ketana wrote: There are 'other' Lexx sites? really? whoowuda thought it...
You mean there's others? Where in the HELL have I been?  *scratches head*


LOL! I was kind of feeling like we were the Bates Motel of LEXXdom. Kind of the only business left open on some old 2 lane highway that nobody uses anymore unless they live in the area.

Hmmmm Think I'll avoid the shower!:c030a:

HEHE...avoid the shower...oh honey go for the toilet and just get it over with!

mayaXXX
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Joined: Tue Oct 24th, 2006
Location: Dark Zone, Naturally
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Mana: 
Adrift wrote: Thanks all for the warm welcome!

Yeah, the films from season 1 are just spastic. What drew me to the series (and I'm sure this is probably true for many others) was the pure weirdness of it all, and its strange that it took me till episode 2 to really appreciate that fact. Season 1 and certain episodes of season 2 remind of those early issues of the sci-fi magazine Heavy Metal in that there's a very, sort of, other worldliness about this series that conventional sci-fi rarely ventures into. Maybe the closest parallel in my mind is Outer Limits or something.

There are certain aspects of the show that I'm not a big fan of. I think a lot of the script work is subpar, and the acting is sometimes a little stiff (that could be due to the just plain bizarreness of the script and a lack of proper direction though), and even in a no boundaries sci-fi show like this, reasonable suspension of disbelief is strained to its limits. I'm also not the biggest fan of in-your-face slapstick, but this is all made up for by the pure innovation of the series' concepts especially as pertains plot lines, character concepts, and the set designs and FX on such a limited budget. The amount of sexuality and gritty/goriness for a sci-fi tv series is also an interesting draw. You just don't really see that, at least, not in the US.

I'm up to episode 4 of season 3 now, and its a very different show in some ways. I like that they toned down the slapstick, and the plot is far more linear which is nice. Its not just 3 people in a ship waiting for something crazy to happen. But it seems to be evolving into more of a standard sci-fi series in a lot of way. Character reactions to unfolding events don't seem as fluid as they ought to be either. That's something that's always been a bit of an issue in previous seasons, but it seems more noticeable to me now. Xenia Seeberg's hairstyle change is also a bit distracting. I mean, the red wig she was wearing in season 2 looked a bit silly sometimes (oddly the first few episodes her hair looked more natural... at some point it got crazier looking, a similar thing happened with Eva Habermann's hair between season 1 and 2), but it sort of defined the look of her character. Her new doo looks great, but I'm just not used to the change yet... she looks like she got a tan too.

It sort of sucks that I didn't catch this series during its original heyday. Each time I watch a new episode I want to talk to other people to get their take, but there's no one really to do that with anymore, and I'm nervous that I might see too many spoilers if I get online and check out what other people think... Ah well. :D

By the way, this is something I think about every time I see Stan... does anyone else think he's the spitting image of the French actor Dominique Pinon. He's the actor who often collaborates with directors Jean Jeunet and Marc Caro. Folks here may know him from City of Lost Children, Amelie, and Alien 4 (though only the last one isn't in French).


Welcome to the board, this is the one Lexx fan board that still has updates on the actors and their current projects.

To give a newbie a little background info on Lexx, I should start by saying that this show is not only a departure from 'regular' Scifi shows but it has what only can be described as a rabid following.

Lexx itself was conceived, written and directed for the most part by Paul Donovan, brother of the famous Michael Donovan, the man behind 'Bowling for Columbine', and has been a Canadian fixture for years. Lexx's premise was always to be more campy and tongue-in-cheek than other science fiction genres, and in fact, when you get to Season 4, it will all hit you like a ton of bricks, just how campy it all really was.

The other major writers, Jeff Hirschfield and Lex Giggeroff are also stunning talents in addition to major league directors that have been used over the years. The writing quality is different than what you'd get with the newer shows simply because those shows take themselves WAY too seriously. Lexx has never been a show that relied on technical expertise in it's mystique or on Fanboys drooling over the newest gadgets that they invented. It was always about the people, first and foremost, and the observation that people are the same all over the universe, and sometimes there's outrageous sex and humor, just like in real life.

The actors of this show have become icons in their own right, and the creators prided themselves on making the actors and actual filming loations available to the fans, right from the start. Many of the actors will still talk to the fans on a regular basis about their involvement in the show, something completely  unheard of in the TV industry. That's what makes the Lexx fan so loyal, It's Not Your Father's Scifi.

When the show was new and on the Scifi channel, the level of fan obsessiveness can only be hinted at, to experience it was something else. It's a very special show and all the folks here are fans for life. We hope you enjoy the show.

As for Brian and his resemblance to the French actor you mentioned, I'm not familiar with him but I will check him out, and Brian is currently starring in a film, 'Hobo with a Shotgun', a Tarantino inspired film that just played at Sundance. Check it out when you get the opportunity, he's amazing in it.

:LogoLexx::stan-h::stanfacial:

JediPug1
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Hey, Adrift... Nice to meet you!  It's always a pleasure to meet some new Lexxians.  :0-02:

Adrift
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Mana: 
Abby1964 wrote:
Angel wrote:
Ketana wrote: There are 'other' Lexx sites? really? whoowuda thought it...
You mean there's others? Where in the HELL have I been?  *scratches head*


LOL! I was kind of feeling like we were the Bates Motel of LEXXdom. Kind of the only business left open on some old 2 lane highway that nobody uses anymore unless they live in the area.

Hmmmm Think I'll avoid the shower!:c030a:


I feel like I'm missing some sort of in joke here. :D The other forums I was thinking of included the Sy-Fy Lexx forum, the IMDB one, and a handful of fan made sites. I'm assuming there's probably some old rivalries between fan sites, or... at least, there might have been.

Adrift
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Mana: 
mayaXXX wrote:
Welcome to the board, this is the one Lexx fan board that still has updates on the actors and their current projects.

To give a newbie a little background info on Lexx, I should start by saying that this show is not only a departure from 'regular' Scifi shows but it has what only can be described as a rabid following.

Lexx itself was conceived, written and directed for the most part by Paul Donovan, brother of the famous Michael Donovan, the man behind 'Bowling for Columbine', and has been a Canadian fixture for years. Lexx's premise was always to be more campy and tongue-in-cheek than other science fiction genres, and in fact, when you get to Season 4, it will all hit you like a ton of bricks, just how campy it all really was.

The other major writers, Jeff Hirschfield and Lex Giggeroff are also stunning talents in addition to major league directors that have been used over the years. The writing quality is different than what you'd get with the newer shows simply because those shows take themselves WAY too seriously. Lexx has never been a show that relied on technical expertise in it's mystique or on Fanboys drooling over the newest gadgets that they invented. It was always about the people, first and foremost, and the observation that people are the same all over the universe, and sometimes there's outrageous sex and humor, just like in real life.

The actors of this show have become icons in their own right, and the creators prided themselves on making the actors and actual filming loations available to the fans, right from the start. Many of the actors will still talk to the fans on a regular basis about their involvement in the show, something completely  unheard of in the TV industry. That's what makes the Lexx fan so loyal, It's Not Your Father's Scifi.

When the show was new and on the Scifi channel, the level of fan obsessiveness can only be hinted at, to experience it was something else. It's a very special show and all the folks here are fans for life. We hope you enjoy the show.

As for Brian and his resemblance to the French actor you mentioned, I'm not familiar with him but I will check him out, and Brian is currently starring in a film, 'Hobo with a Shotgun', a Tarantino inspired film that just played at Sundance. Check it out when you get the opportunity, he's amazing in it.

:LogoLexx::stan-h::stanfacial:


Wow! Thank you for the very informative reply. As I mentioned, I was aware that the show had a cult following, but I was unfortunately unable to check the show out myself for a variety of reasons. The uniqueness of the show obviously justifies a rabid fan base, and that the talent still communicates with the fans is very cool. I was aware of some of the production stuff you mentioned from previous wiki-ing, but its good to get the details again, because I tend to skim information in hopes of not running into spoilers (I audibly groaned when I ran into a spoiler today for the episode "Boomtown" that featured a living "Kai"). I was aware of Brian Downey's cameo in Hobo with a Shotgun. Saw him in the preview. Very cool. Out of curiosity, since I'm watching this series on Netflix, I'm pretty much watching the uncensored version of the show (lots of nudity in certain episodes). I know this show is a joint venture between Canadian and German production companies, do you know if the series was shown in those locations in its entirety before the Sci-Fi channel picked it up, or did they pick it up later. Also in the version I'm watching, the 1st season opens telling you that its associated with Showtime. Again, was that originally the case and then Sci-Fi picked it up and put it into rotation after censoring for basic cable?

Oh, and here's some not so great pictures of Dominique Pinon. For some reason its hard to find good images of him. They're not identical, but man could they play brothers.

You won't be disappointed if you see any of the French fantasy films I mentioned with him in them either, and to that list you can add Delicatessen and MicMacs. Just have to have a tolerance for subtitles.





Last edited on Thu Feb 10th, 2011 11:54 pm by Adrift

Adrift
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JediPug1 wrote:
Hey, Adrift... Nice to meet you!  It's always a pleasure to meet some new Lexxians.  :0-02:


Thanks for the welcome Jedi! Its just good to know I'm not alone.

Abby1964
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Mana: 
Adrift wrote:
Abby1964 wrote:
Angel wrote:
Ketana wrote: There are 'other' Lexx sites? really? whoowuda thought it...
You mean there's others? Where in the HELL have I been?  *scratches head*


LOL! I was kind of feeling like we were the Bates Motel of LEXXdom. Kind of the only business left open on some old 2 lane highway that nobody uses anymore unless they live in the area.

Hmmmm Think I'll avoid the shower!:c030a:


I feel like I'm missing some sort of in joke here. :D The other forums I was thinking of included the Sy-Fy Lexx forum, the IMDB one, and a handful of fan made sites. I'm assuming there's probably some old rivalries between fan sites, or... at least, there might have been.


When I started getting back into LEXX last year and started checking out the the different LEXX forums they were there but they were dead. Maybe a handful of posts for the entire previous year. Every time I came lurking around this forum, there were new posts being made.

LEXX fandom is like getting on one of those old 2 lane highways. You drive along and pass deserted gas stations that advertising gas for $1.39 a gallon, the storefronts have plywood over the windows and weeds have almost taken over the parking lot growing up through the cracks in the asphalt.

You don't find too many businesses open because they are all building up around the interstate and the old highway which used to be the main drag is forgotten except for the people who live in the area, all the traffic is over on the Interstate. They just can't be bothered with the scenic route.

Except for some die hards and the new people who stumble across the show, LEXX is something that came and went and they are all raving over some new show and forgotten that they ever liked LEXX. LEXX is the old 2 lane Highway while the newest offerings are the interstate. Most LEXX Forums today are like the deserted gas stations. They may be on the road but they are relics.

Adrift
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Mana: 
Abby1964 wrote:
When I started getting back into LEXX last year and started checking out the the different LEXX forums they were there but they were dead. Maybe a handful of posts for the entire previous year. Every time I came lurking around this forum, there were new posts being made.

LEXX fandom is like getting on one of those old 2 lane highways. You drive along and pass deserted gas stations that advertising gas for $1.39 a gallon, the storefronts have plywood over the windows and weeds have almost taken over the parking lot growing up through the cracks in the asphalt.

You don't find too many businesses open because they are all building up around the interstate and the old highway which used to be the main drag is forgotten except for the people who live in the area, all the traffic is over on the Interstate. They just can't be bothered with the scenic route.

Except for some die hards and the new people who stumble across the show, LEXX is something that came and went and they are all raving over some new show and forgotten that they ever liked LEXX. LEXX is the old 2 lane Highway while the newest offerings are the interstate. Most LEXX Forums today are like the deserted gas stations. They may be on the road but they are relics.


Wow. Wonderful analogy. I've always loved those empty highways with dated billboards and shuttered truck stops though, so I don't mind if its not bustling with rush hour traffic. Its an interesting sociological phenomenon how some of these shows can have a relatively small, yet absolutely devoted fan followings. This obviously isn't your mainstream Buffy, Star Trek or even Babylon 5 type fan following. Seems to me more comparable to the fan followings in the wake of the original The Prisoner or Twin Peaks.

I'm now on episode 6 of season 3. I didn't think I'd like where season 3 was going initially, but even though things have totally shifted gears I'm finding I'm just as enthralled. I hate to admit it, but I'm thinking I like it more than season 2, or maybe its that I like both seasons the same so far and its the contrast between the 3 seasons I've watched so far thats so intriguing. This is a very odd show. Extremely enjoyable.

Last edited on Fri Feb 11th, 2011 03:00 am by Adrift

mayaXXX
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Mana: 
To give you a quick breakdown  on the format of the show, it is broken up into 4 seasons, the first season being the actual films made for Showtime back in the mid-90's.

1. I Worship His Shadow (with Barry Bostwick), Eating Pattern (with Rutger Hauer), Supernova (with Time Curry) and Gigashadow (with Malcolm McDowell) were all made for Showtime films to be shown on cable only. The actual tapes came out in the UK first, then Germany and finally in Canada.

2 The Series was picked up for distribution and it showed on Scifi tv in the UK before it showed in the US. It also showed on Candadian and German TV, but not exactly at the same time.

3. When Scifi picked it up, there was already a big buzz about it, but they stupidly tried to market the sex aspect of the show by showing the majority of the episodes that Xenia Seeberg was in, and out of order of the regular series, making for some extremely pissed off fans. The network never marketed the show properly and there remains to this day some very bad blood between the fans and one Bonnie Hammer, the then exec in charge of marketing Lexx. She just did not 'get' the show and tried her best to switch it from one time slot to another in an attempt to bury it.

4. Despite her efforts, the fans demand generated 4 seasons.

5. Season 2, were individual stand-alone episodes with one or two story-arcs inserted, tons of humour and sex and lots of weirdness. Jeffrey Hirschfield wrote many of those eps and his deranged sense of humour is evident.

6. Season 3, which was primarily written by Paul Donovan instead of Jeffrey Hirschfield, was much darker and a continuing 13-episode story arc that was filmed in Hi-Def in Germany at a time when Hi-Def had not kicked in yet for US TV. It also introduced a new permanent cast member in Nigel Bennett, who played the evil Prince. (formerly of Forever Knight)

7. Season 4 went back to using Jeffrey as a writer for many of the episodes and there are a few 3 story arc eps that tie together. Some say S4 was not the best season, but the writers knew at that point  that the series was wrapping up and threw in the kitchen sink, plot-wise, and tied up all loose ends by the last episode.

8. The different writing styles of Paul Donovan, Jeff Hirschfield and Lex Giggeroff are very evident if you watch the individual seasons 'flavor'. Jeffrey has the most outrageous sense of humour and has no qualms about crossing the line to bad taste.

 Lex has the honor of not only having the actual ship 'The Lexx' named after him, but the character of 'Giggerota the Wicked', played by the gorgeous Ellen Dubin. He also played several characters throughout the series, including His Divine Shadow. Jeffrey was the voice and character of 790-Robot Head, and has the best lines simply because he gets to write them himself.  Paul didn't appear on camera, but directed tons of the eps, and had guest appearances of notable directors from Europe and Canada during the series. There is tons more history to the show, but this should give you a basic background on the series mythology.

As for the Syfy channel board, it used to be very active back in the 90's, but with the new shows taking over in popularity and the incredibly dumb decision of the network to change it's name to 'Syfy' (wtf?), traffic on the board dwindled and people visited other fan boards. The other 2 remaining boards were ones that we started and others inherited when we built this board. The Brian Downey board also exists for not only Lexx but all of Brian's other work, and definitely should be visited if you're interested in his other projects.

Neither Michael or Xenia have thier own official boards simply because we use this one to fill in for that, being as the official  http://www.michael-mcmanus.com site is the sister site to this board. You'll find lots of Lexx stuff on that site in addition to just the actor's section.

Enjoy.

:0-02::bunnyfacial::xevfacial::stanfacial::princefacial::priestfacial::xre_21::carrot1::LogoLexx::lexxicon::re_06:

Angel
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Mana: 
If you really want an in-depth humorous look into the series, I'd suggest you read Bilbo's episode reviews. They are awesome!

Adrift
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Mana: 
mayaXXX wrote: To give you a quick breakdown  on the format of the show, it is broken up into 4 seasons, the first season being the actual films made for Showtime back in the mid-90's.

1. I Worship His Shadow (with Barry Bostwick), Eating Pattern (with Rutger Hauer), Supernova (with Time Curry) and Gigashadow (with Malcolm McDowell) were all made for Showtime films to be shown on cable only. The actual tapes came out in the UK first, then Germany and finally in Canada.

2 The Series was picked up for distribution and it showed on Scifi tv in the UK before it showed in the US. It also showed on Candadian and German TV, but not exactly at the same time.

3. When Scifi picked it up, there was already a big buzz about it, but they stupidly tried to market the sex aspect of the show by showing the majority of the episodes that Xenia Seeberg was in, and out of order of the regular series, making for some extremely pissed off fans. The network never marketed the show properly and there remains to this day some very bad blood between the fans and one Bonnie Hammer, the then exec in charge of marketing Lexx. She just did not 'get' the show and tried her best to switch it from one time slot to another in an attempt to bury it.

4. Despite her efforts, the fans demand generated 4 seasons.

5. Season 2, were individual stand-alone episodes with one or two story-arcs inserted, tons of humour and sex and lots of weirdness. Jeffrey Hirschfield wrote many of those eps and his deranged sense of humour is evident.

6. Season 3, which was primarily written by Paul Donovan instead of Jeffrey Hirschfield, was much darker and a continuing 13-episode story arc that was filmed in Hi-Def in Germany at a time when Hi-Def had not kicked in yet for US TV. It also introduced a new permanent cast member in Nigel Bennett, who played the evil Prince. (formerly of Forever Knight)

7. Season 4 went back to using Jeffrey as a writer for many of the episodes and there are a few 3 story arc eps that tie together. Some say S4 was not the best season, but the writers knew at that point  that the series was wrapping up and threw in the kitchen sink, plot-wise, and tied up all loose ends by the last episode.

8. The different writing styles of Paul Donovan, Jeff Hirschfield and Lex Giggeroff are very evident if you watch the individual seasons 'flavor'. Jeffrey has the most outrageous sense of humour and has no qualms about crossing the line to bad taste.

 Lex has the honor of not only having the actual ship 'The Lexx' named after him, but the character of 'Giggerota the Wicked', played by the gorgeous Ellen Dubin. He also played several characters throughout the series, including His Divine Shadow. Jeffrey was the voice and character of 790-Robot Head, and has the best lines simply because he gets to write them himself.  Paul didn't appear on camera, but directed tons of the eps, and had guest appearances of notable directors from Europe and Canada during the series. There is tons more history to the show, but this should give you a basic background on the series mythology.

As for the Syfy channel board, it used to be very active back in the 90's, but with the new shows taking over in popularity and the incredibly dumb decision of the network to change it's name to 'Syfy' (wtf?), traffic on the board dwindled and people visited other fan boards. The other 2 remaining boards were ones that we started and others inherited when we built this board. The Brian Downey board also exists for not only Lexx but all of Brian's other work, and definitely should be visited if you're interested in his other projects.

Neither Michael or Xenia have thier own official boards simply because we use this one to fill in for that, being as the official  http://www.michael-mcmanus.com site is the sister site to this board. You'll find lots of Lexx stuff on that site in addition to just the actor's section.

Enjoy.

:0-02::bunnyfacial::xevfacial::stanfacial::princefacial::priestfacial::xre_21::carrot1::LogoLexx::lexxicon::re_06:

Very informative! Thank you.

I'm wondering who's writing I actually identify with the most then. Sounds like it was Jeffery Hirschfield's weirdness that attracted me to the series to begin with but if he's also responsible for the over the top silliness then maybe not so much. Eh, more likely than not its the combined talents of all 3 that pulled me in. The Beatles were almost always better together than solo. :)

So, is there any plans for the 3 writers to get together again at some point? Have any of them done anything as experimental as Lexx? Any talk of future Lexx projects?

Adrift
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Mana: 
Angel wrote: If you really want an in-depth humorous look into the series, I'd suggest you read Bilbo's episode reviews. They are awesome!
Yep, I've read quite a few of them already. They're fun to read and he's pretty funny. My only complaint is that he's not very critical. There's been more than a few epsiodes where I've thought to myself "What?? Come on... she wouldn't say that!" or think to myself that the logic of the plotline in a scene just makes too little sense... the writing got sloppy, the acting felt stiff, the FX were beyond bad, or whatever. He doesn't really criticize those types of things very heavily, and maybe that's because he was reviewing from the perspective of one who just didn't think it was important to take the show too seriously. Its the sort of show that you kind of just ride along with without over thinking it. But I don't know. There are some episodes and concepts that I think are just works of art, and I think that if you appreciate art its sometimes worth taking it a little seriously. I don't know. :)

mayaXXX
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Mana: 
Unfortunately no plans for any future Lexx projects, and the writing team hasn't worked together since then. Paul Donovan did a couple of films after Lexx, 'Conclave' and 'Blissestrasse', one of which starred Brian Downey and the other starred Michael McManus, but no combined efforts on the parts of the writers. Many have asked about a reunion but it's just not in the cards.

:bounce_pinka:

Adrift
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Mana: 
mayaXXX wrote: Unfortunately no plans for any future Lexx projects, and the writing team hasn't worked together since then. Paul Donovan did a couple of films after Lexx, 'Conclave' and 'Blissestrasse', one of which starred Brian Downey and the other starred Michael McManus, but no combined efforts on the parts of the writers. Many have asked about a reunion but it's just not in the cards.

:bounce_pinka:
Yeah. Figures. Ohwell.

Czehoski
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Mana: 
This site does have a 90s look & feel, it's a cool throwback.  Just wanted to second the compliment.  :cool:

Adrift
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Mana: 
Czehoski wrote:
This site does have a 90s look & feel, it's a cool throwback.  Just wanted to second the compliment.  :cool:

Yep. As soon as I found it I was like, Wow! This feels like the "show" in a way. By the way, for some reason its hard for me to simply call it a "show". Its a creative piece of work of art. I've been interested and involved in the punk scene for almost 20 years now, and even in the 80s, when I was a kid, my dad, an artist, would take me to the college section and art district of Providence, RI to go gallery hopping. Punks, and New Wavers, and Skinheads were everywhere, and what's always drawn me to that scene has been that no boundaries sort of creativity... from the music to the look to ideology. I see a lot of that with Lexx, especially evident in the first season. Its out there and I love it. This web forum has a lot of that same feel. :)

mayaXXX
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Mana: 
Thanks for the compliments on the site. Our board theme is 'Black Metal', but is a throwback to a sort of gothic-steam-punk look to it. Lexx was also considered a sort of gothic space opera, hence the weird costumes and hair.

:bounce_pinka:

Kaden
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Mana: 
"Gothic space opera" is the perfect description. :P 

 

Adrift
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Well having dabbled in the Goth scene along with the punk, and post-punk scenes I can certainly relate to the steampunk/Gothic aesthetic. Kai is your definitive Deathrocker /(slash) Sisters of Mercy type late 80s to late 90s Goth rocker. To be honest though, I thought living Kai had a better hairdo and (obviously) better skin than dead Kai :D

Last edited on Sat Feb 12th, 2011 05:46 am by Adrift

Angel
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Mana: 
Kai's hairstyle is supposedly based on the look from 'The Cure'.

http://www.thecure.com/photos/default.aspx?fid=8013

Adrift
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Mana: 
Angel wrote:
Kai's hairstyle is supposedly based on the look from 'The Cure'.

http://www.thecure.com/photos/default.aspx?fid=8013


Yeah, I think every Goth's hairstyle is ultimately based on Robert Smith's :P

mayaXXX
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Mana: 
Adrift wrote: Well having dabbled in the Goth scene along with the punk, and post-punk scenes I can certainly relate to the steampunk/Gothic aesthetic. Kai is your definitive Deathrocker /(slash) Sisters of Mercy type late 80s to late 90s Goth rocker. To be honest though, I thought living Kai had a better hairdo and (obviously) better skin than dead Kai :D


Well if you're into Gothic art and punk,  you might recoginze infamous gothic artist Jordan Smith of Darkview, who has designed some great Lexx graphics, he's also a long-time fan. His stuff is legendary. Visit his site, all his Lexx stuff is in gallery #4.

http://www.darkview.co.uk/







All images copyright Jordan Smith.

Adrift
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Mana: 
Nope, can't say that I'm familiar with him or his work. But you're right, his graphics are pretty snazzy. I especially like the last one. Thanks for the link.

JediPug1
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Mana: 
Adrift wrote: JediPug1 wrote:
Hey, Adrift... Nice to meet you!  It's always a pleasure to meet some new Lexxians.  :0-02:


Thanks for the welcome Jedi! Its just good to know I'm not alone.

I was alone for years!  No one I knew watched Lexx... *shudders* Those were dark times... I'm so glad I found this little refuge!  I just wish it didn't take me so long...


mayaXXX
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Mana: 
Yeah, we're your friendly neighborhood Lexx support group. :new_shocked:

Abby1964
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Mana: 
mayaXXX wrote:
Yeah, we're your friendly neighborhood Lexx support group. :new_shocked:
Why do I now have the urge to stand up and announce "Hi My Name is Abby and I'm a LEXXaholic"?:BigB:

Kaden
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Hi Abby.  :c030a:

Adrift
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:D

So I'm in season 4. I was expecting this season to be a let down because from what I had read on forums and reviews, 4 often seems to be most folks least favorite. I just finished ep. 9 (Fluff Daddy), and you know what?... I have to say that, so far, this season has the best scripted dialogue I've seen yet. The humor is rapid fire and really funny. The actors are interacting with one another in a way that seems far more realistic to me. And for the first time I'm understanding some of Zev, Kai, and Stan's motivations (or lack thereof) for doing what they do. I don't remember how many episodes in previous seasons I'd ask myself, "now why would he let them on board the Lexx" or "why would she want go to that planet", and the answer is that, compared to earthlings, they're either naive or fearless (well, except Stan who's mostly horny and cowardly). Another thing is that, the show actually feels less B than it did before. That's a good and a bad thing, but it probably has to do with the recognizable backdrop. 790 has way better dialogue this season. I don't know how much more I could stand of him yelling either Xev/Zev or Kai's names, but he's such a punk now that I'm surprised someone hasn't thrown him over the side of the captain's deck.

My only issue with this season so far is that I really loved the out of this universe zaniness from seasons 1 and 2. I loved the fact that the creators were forced to find ways to bring us new places, planets, people, and plot lines. This season has the feel of season 2, but better writing and on familiar turf, but we lose the otherworldliness (obviously). If I could combine the quality of the writing in this season, with the locales of season 3, and the offbeat creativity and zaniness of seasons 1 and 2, it'd be the perfect show. Ohwell, guess I'll just have to appreciate each season for what it is.

Last edited on Tue Feb 15th, 2011 05:30 am by Adrift

mayaXXX
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Mana: 
Adrift wrote: :D

So I'm in season 4. I was expecting this season to be a let down because from what I had read on forums and reviews, 4 often seems to be most folks least favorite. I just finished ep. 9 (Fluff Daddy), and you know what?... I have to say that, so far, this season has the best scripted dialogue I've seen yet. The humor is rapid fire and really funny. The actors are interacting with one another in a way that seems far more realistic to me. And for the first time I'm understanding some of Zev, Kai, and Stan's motivations (or lack thereof) for doing what they do. I don't remember how many episodes in previous seasons I'd ask myself, "now why would he let them on board the Lexx" or "why would she want go to that planet", and the answer is that, compared to earthlings, they're either naive or fearless (well, except Stan who's mostly horny and cowardly). Another thing is that, the show actually feels less B than it did before. That's a good and a bad thing, but it probably has to do with the recognizable backdrop. 790 has way better dialogue this season. I don't know how much more I could stand of him yelling either Xev/Zev or Kai's names, but he's such a punk now that I'm surprised someone hasn't thrown him over the side of the captain's deck.

My only issue with this season so far is that I really loved the out of this universe zaniness from seasons 1 and 2. I loved the fact that the creators were forced to find ways to bring us new places, planets, people, and plot lines. This season has the feel of season 2, but better writing and on familiar turf, but we lose the otherworldliness (obviously). If I could combine the quality of the writing in this season, with the locales of season 3, and the offbeat creativity and zaniness of seasons 1 and 2, it'd be the perfect show. Ohwell, guess I'll just have to appreciate each season for what it is.


You've pretty much it the nail on the head as far as the writing goes. Jeff wrote most of this season's scripts and especially his own lines, and his outrageous humor is evident. How many Scifi shows can parody both the Porn industry and Bill Clinton in one episode? As for the characters motivations, Stanley: horny and cowardly is exactly right, and Xev is always and forever the adventurer. As for 790 being so annoying, just wait a couple more eps to see what happens. Oh, by the way, that was Jeff in the part of the Pizza delivery porn guy, Dick Dongler.

The one big complaint that fans had about S4 was that it was set on Earth, and there were too many political innuendos that wouldn't have been evident with a off-world setting, otherwise it would have been the best season. My personal favorite was Fluffdaddy, simply because of the rants that 'LiveKai' does about the fans.

Oh, btw, there are 2 deleted scenes from Fluffdaddy that you can find either on the DVD or at the MM.com site, that gives you a big insight into the actors and characters mental state that will make a ton more sense to you. They just didn't have time to air it. The files on the MM.com site can be downloaded and are in AVI format. The Youtube ones will be lesser quality and FLV files.

http://www.michael-mcmanus.com/video.htm

Scroll down th page til  you see Lexx episode scenes, then look for the Fluffdaddy deleted scenes 1 and 2, and you can also find them on Youtube,

Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmzqGoPRLNA

Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQk2n5HdlcA

 

Abby1964
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Mana: 
The appeal of season 4 for me was all the political innuendo and parodying of society. So much was 'dead on' with what was/is happening in the world.

As far as 790, I don't know if it was intentional or not but it seemed that he started becoming more 'like Kai' or at least what he perceived Kai to be. After all technically an assassin is a 'serial killer'. I think that played out well with 790 changing from what he was when he was in love with Xev to what he became when he was obsessed with Kai.

Kaden
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Mana: 
I really dug the scathing satire of US politics in season 4. I think we could use more of that. Our notion of 'superiority' can be a bit ugly, I think. Sometimes our ego needs to be taken down a peg or two. Common view seems to be different = bad. Which makes no sense to me.

The change 790 underwent was interesting. When he was obsessed with Z/Xev he would do anything she asked. He helped them. But when he switched to Kai, he became eeevil and kept plotting their destruction. I say a psycho robot head is an entertaining robot head.

Abby1964
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Mana: 
I don't know how I missed those deleted scenes from Fluff Daddy but the first one gave me flashbacks to the show In Living Color and Damon Wayans Booked On Phonics skit. At least Live Kai did use real words.

Kai-trina
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Mana: 
hello... =)

darthomatic
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Mana: 
Adrift wrote: Yeah, I think every Goth's hairstyle is ultimately based on Robert Smith's :P

:D  snorties



meanwhile .... downey DOES look like pinon.  despite having seen all of lexx and most of pinon's work, I needed you to point that out.

hola, by the way.  welcome to the nuthouse :c030a:

Adrift
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Mana: 
mayaXXX wrote:
You've pretty much it the nail on the head as far as the writing goes. Jeff wrote most of this season's scripts and especially his own lines, and his outrageous humor is evident. How many Scifi shows can parody both the Porn industry and Bill Clinton in one episode? As for the characters motivations, Stanley: horny and cowardly is exactly right, and Xev is always and forever the adventurer. As for 790 being so annoying, just wait a couple more eps to see what happens. Oh, by the way, that was Jeff in the part of the Pizza delivery porn guy, Dick Dongler.


Yeah, I had read that that was Jeff. Very funny. I actually really liked his sort of casually disinterested take on that character. I would have liked to have seen more of him. :D As far as the Clinton thing... I must have missed the context. To be honest I'm fairly apolitical and political satire is so easy to do, and so often done, that it really does nothing for me. Also, for me, the best parts of season 4 were usually the episodes not taking place in the US. I loved the episodes taking place in Newfoundland, and Transylvania. Seeing as the show was created by Canadians and Germans I sort of expected to see less focus on the US, but goes to show how much a cultural influence the States have I suppose (and I'm sure being featured on the SciFi network had something to do with it too).

The one big complaint that fans had about S4 was that it was set on Earth, and there were too many political innuendos that wouldn't have been evident with a off-world setting, otherwise it would have been the best season. My personal favorite was Fluffdaddy, simply because of the rants that 'LiveKai' does about the fans.

Yep. Agreed. I thought live Kai's fate was a bit disappointing, but I really dug seeing McManus sort of riffing on art and artists that take themselves too seriously, and also the dynamic between artists and their fans.

Oh, btw, there are 2 deleted scenes from Fluffdaddy that you can find either on the DVD or at the MM.com site, that gives you a big insight into the actors and characters mental state that will make a ton more sense to you. They just didn't have time to air it. The files on the MM.com site can be downloaded and are in AVI format. The Youtube ones will be lesser quality and FLV files.

Thank you for mentioning this. Very funny and informative.

Last edited on Fri Feb 18th, 2011 01:33 am by Adrift

Adrift
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Mana: 
Abby1964 wrote:
The appeal of season 4 for me was all the political innuendo and parodying of society. So much was 'dead on' with what was/is happening in the world.


Ah, yeah. Well as I mentioned to maya, I'm not so much a fan of the political stuff... It has a tendency to date itself pretty quickly, but the general parodying of society as a whole was funny, but pessimistic. Really dark when you step away and think about it.

As far as 790, I don't know if it was intentional or not but it seemed that he started becoming more 'like Kai' or at least what he perceived Kai to be. After all technically an assassin is a 'serial killer'. I think that played out well with 790 changing from what he was when he was in love with Xev to what he became when he was obsessed with Kai.

You know... that makes a lot of sense, and after reading this I was able to watch the last half of season 4 with that in mind and it really came together.

Kai-trinahello... =)

Hello back :)

darthomatic wrote:
Adrift wrote: ]Yeah, I think every Goth's hairstyle is ultimately based on Robert Smith's :P

:D  snorties


I offer my own coiffure from a few years back as exhibit A and B... though admittedly deathhawks are probably more inspired by folks like Daniel Ash from Bauhaus or more specifically Johnny Slut of Specimen.




meanwhile .... downey DOES look like pinon.  despite having seen all of lexx and most of pinon's work, I needed you to point that out.

Haha. Well I'm glad someone else caught the resemblance. Every time I saw one or the other actor my mind flipped to the other. Its not just the look, but even the sort of spazzy acting style as well (though, I hate to say, I think Pinon is maybe the better actor, especially after having rewatched Delicatessen recently).

hola, by the way.  welcome to the nuthouse :c030a:


Thank you. I appreciate it. Really enjoying myself here. :)

Last edited on Fri Feb 18th, 2011 02:37 am by Adrift

Adrift
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Mana: 
Though this show has been over for years now, there are possible spoilers ahead for those like myself who hadn't seen the series. Fair warning!


Anyways, Sorry for posting back to back. Not sure if you folks have rules on that sort of thing. So tonight I watched the rest of season 4. All in all it was a great season, and a wonderful show from start to finish. The beginning of season 4 starts out real strong, but I felt there were too many filler type episodes towards the end. The creators of the series really could have made a far deeper impact on the fans, I think, had they spanned the last 3 episodes or so into a cohesive story arc dealing with the fate of the crew and the Lexx. Stuffing all of that into one episode, and really only the last half on the last episode seemed a bit unfair to me. And of course, like others I'm sure, I didn't like how they resolved Kai's storyline. The sexual tension you feel over the course of 4 seasons between Kai and Zev is never really resolved. Maybe there was a point to that, but I found it to be a real disappointment. They even taunt the viewer with hope a couple of times in the episode, and I thought that was a bit unnecessarily cruel. Almost like the creators knew that the audience wanted and expected a satisfying resolution, and they simply a.) didn't care, or b.) were stating in their own way... "this is just a TV show". I just don't know if that's fair though or even... artistically ethical. :D


I loved Stan's last stand where, for pretty much the first time, we see him do something totally selfless and courageous. Very cool. And yeah, the goodbye scenes made me a bit misty eyed. I suppose I should have seen it all coming what with the chess game episode mirroring the Seventh Seal and whatnot. But I was hoping against hope that that foreshadowing would lead to nothing, or at least... to an acceptable resolution.

If I were to write my own ending the particle collider would have had some sort of cosmic effect on Kai giving him immortality in the same way that Prince had. Kai and Zev get together, and the adventures continue with Kai being Yang to Prince's Yin in some sort of eternal conflict.

Meh... I don't know. Maybe the end we have was for the best...

Last edited on Fri Feb 18th, 2011 02:30 am by Adrift

mayaXXX
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Mana: 
Well  your take on the filler episodes in Season 4 is something that has been debated quite a few times. I've mentioned myself that I could have done without the 'Prime Ridge-Mort-Moss' storylines etc.

The endings affected alot of folks differently. Yes, they did make sure to insert a sexual tension between Kai and Zev/Xev, but that was strictly from Xev's point of view. Kai's motivations from the time he's introduced in Season One, is one of redemption. Kai's storyline is an archetype of the Destroyer/Messiah character (even though Michael sees him as a more reptilian character) in that Kai's one and only goal is to find complete peace in death, and not in life everlasting.

 At the end of the Series, Kai has lived over 6000 years and feels that is plenty enough and apparently his job as a Divine Assassin has forced him to commit acts he would have never dreamed of doing in his mortal life, and feels he needs to atone for those acts, even though he's been under the control of the HDS for most of that time. When he finally gets back his free will, his original sense of honor and righteousnous reappears, so in order to atone for his past, he HAS to die for the final time, of course, with a great sacrfice.

Many speculate that had Prince actually made him human and he'd survived the last battle, that he would not have been able to live with his dark past and it would have driven him insane, hence the disturbed 'Live Kai's' unstable rantings, his soul having been reincarnated into a new form, but the Karmic retribution having it's toll on his psyche.

For each of the characters, the season brought each one into balance in the following ways:

Stanley finds his courage and doesn't depend on the 'little head' to do the thinking anymore. Xev realizes that she's already had a family and her search for physical love is really not that important, 790's personality is 'reset' by his attack and he is more of the pure romantic he was in the first season. Kai gets his atonement and is allowed to finally die and reunite with his loved ones in whatever place they believed in.

Anyway, that's one of the more enduring of the theories around the last season's endings.

:LogoLexx::bunnyfacial::priestfacial::princefacial::stanfacial::xevfacial::kai-red:

Adrift
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Mana: 
mayaXXX wrote:
Kai's motivations from the time he's introduced in Season One, is one of redemption. Kai's storyline is an archetype of the Destroyer/Messiah character (even though Michael sees him as a more reptilian character) in that Kai's one and only goal is to find complete peace in death, and not in life everlasting.

 At the end of the Series, Kai has lived over 6000 years and feels that is plenty enough and apparently his job as a Divine Assassin has forced him to commit acts he would have never dreamed of doing in his mortal life, and feels he needs to atone for those acts, even though he's been under the control of the HDS for most of that time. When he finally gets back his free will, his original sense of honor and righteousnous reappears, so in order to atone for his past, he HAS to die for the final time, of course, with a great sacrfice.

Many speculate that had Prince actually made him human and he'd survived the last battle, that he would not have been able to live with his dark past and it would have driven him insane, hence the disturbed 'Live Kai's' unstable rantings, his soul having been reincarnated into a new form, but the Karmic retribution having it's toll on his psyche.


Yes, I had considered this, but I just don't think I'm satisfied with Zev's unrequited love for Kai. My main issue with the series from the perspective of Kai is that... with the exception of episode 1 of season 1, and maybe Brigadoom, the real protagonist throughout the series is Xev/Zev. I'd say Stan and Zev, but Stan is often so selfish that its hard for the viewer to feel empathy for his character a lot of the time. And 790 was mostly comic relief. We want Kai to be our tragic protagonist from the start, but as the show evolves this seems impossible. How is the audience supposed to connect to a character with little to no psychological or emotional motivation, who can't be harmed in any real way, and who apparently spends the majority of his existence in a cryo chamber? I mean, he's a great Byronic anti-hero, but Zev is the one we truly connect with the most I think. She's the most sensitive, multi-dimensional, and most human character of them all (even if in fact Stan genetically is). Add to this, season after season, the show is built on that sexual tension, which, you're probably right, is sort of a replacement for the need for actual love. I just can't help but think that she gets short shrifted in the end. Could Kai have lived with the evil he had done as an assassin? I don't know. It would have been an interesting twist on his character had he remained alive. I feel his character was pre-redeemed in that, he died to his sins before committing them. There's no need to re-kill him to accomplish redemption or restitution.

I suppose the theory you propose is probably spot on, but I suppose I'm just not completely satisfied. I'm sure I'm not the only one.

That said, it didn't take away from my enjoyment of the series overall. Wonderful show, and I'm glad I found this forum. :)

Last edited on Fri Feb 18th, 2011 04:20 am by Adrift

Kaden
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Mana: 
I'm glad the series ended the way it did. It made it memorable. When I saw the last episode for the first time (and last time. I don't wanna see it again as I am a wuss) I was distraught. But that sad ending stuck in my brain forever it seemed like. I kept thinking about it, about other ways it could have (or should have) ended, about miraculous ways that Kai and Lexx could have been saved (Lexx's death made me cry just as much as Kai's death). I wanted a happy ending for everyone.

But I don't think a nice, tidy happy ending would have been as affecting. At the time it would have been nice, and caused less embarrassing blubbering, but it would have been forgettable. Besides, Kai was a tragic hero and it is the requirement of all tragic heroes to die heroically.

There is something unusual about this show, aside from the obvious, I mean. I saw the original run on the SciFi channel and for years random scenes or lines would just pop into my head out of nowhere. It just really stuck with me. And then... I was compelled to seek out other people with odd and/or unusual tastes who get it!

:c030a: :2567:


Jensau
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Mana: 
I hated but also kind of loved the ending!

I cried like a bloody baby at the real death of Kai, his story is one of the saddest I've ever come across, but I guess, for him, it was the right ending. Zev/Xev's story is equally as tragic. She had a terrible childhood and was ready to die before she was changed into a love slave, if it wasn't for the cluster lizard in her she probably would have topped herself! She didn't just want to have sex with Kai, she really did love him but he was just not capable of reciprocating!

I think if the writers of the show had been female (or at least one of them was!) we might have seen a different ending. The Beans were big fat teasers and sometimes horribly cruel to the fans, just giving us little bits of what could have been. For example, in The Key, when Kai walks up to Xev and snogs her face off, (that still makes me go weak at the knees) and when he says that he "wants her, right now"!! (phoarr!!!) For a guy with no motivation he sure was motivated in THAT episode! But, as we know, it was only to test Xev, so that he could be sure that it wasn't really her. (Nasty Beans)

Nothing in Lexx ever really came to a happy conclusion and I think that added to the spirit of Lexx, it wasn't conventional, it wasn't ethical and it wasn't always moral.
I also don't think they tied up all the story for Stan and Xev, they were still stranded in space on Little Lexx and they didn't have Kai to come to the rescue when they got into trouble, so God knows how they ended up!!

The reason I also love the ending is it STILL has people talking about it, all these years later!!
(Clever Beans!)

And a big YAY for Lexxverse, for giving us a place to talk about it!!:2567:

Last edited on Fri Feb 18th, 2011 08:57 am by Jensau

Adrift
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Mana: 
Somehow I have a feeling that people would have been talking about Lexx all these years later regardless of the ending. :) I'm not advocating a happy ending necessarily; I just felt that there were some loose strings that needed wrapped up. I suppose what I'm saying is that the dynamic between Kai and Zev felt like it should have gone somewhere, and that tension was built up throughout the years, and then, instead, that whole plot device was sort of dropped and forgotten for the ending we received. Possibly my perspective is unique in that I wasn't at all familiar with the show outside of buzz, and that I watched the whole series back to back in a relatively short amount of time. Oh well, what's done is done. I'm not complaining really, just slightly let down at what could have been.

Abby1964
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Mana: 
Yeah that ending was heart wrenching until you really take the time to think back to when Kai told us the only want the dead really have-to be dead. And then in The Game when he talks about The Dream Zone you realize just how cruel his existence is.

The Brunnen G believed in an afterlife. Everyone that Kai knew in life is in this afterlife, but it's denied to him. You kind of realize that HDS was dead on when he said "punishment beyond death" You realize that for Kai dying was not such a bad thing. It was a release from 6000 years of punishment, he can finally join his people in the afterlife that he being raised as a Brunnen G would also have believed in.

Adrift
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Abby1964 wrote:
Yeah that ending was heart wrenching until you really take the time to think back to when Kai told us the only want the dead really have-to be dead. And then in The Game when he talks about The Dream Zone you realize just how cruel his existence is.

The Brunnen G believed in an afterlife. Everyone that Kai knew in life is in this afterlife, but it's denied to him. You kind of realize that HDS was dead on when he said "punishment beyond death" You realize that for Kai dying was not such a bad thing. It was a release from 6000 years of punishment, he can finally join his people in the afterlife that he being raised as a Brunnen G would also have believed in.


What do you think Kai's afterlife will be like? Will it be acting and singing for all eternity like what we see in Brigadoon? Will he be reunited with his long lost love, and forget about the events that happened in the intervening 6000 year period? What happens, do you think, to Zev and Stan? Will they be killed upon contact with the first malicious alien race? Zev is still a love slave in some sense, but she'll never be attracted to Stan (I almost think that Zev thinks of Stan as a brother or a relative, that's why she can have an eye for men like the old dude from Texx Lexx, but not for Stan), so what happens to her do you think? Will anyone come as close to her heart as Kai did? What's the fate of Prince, and bunny, and the president? I think I might need to rewatch the last episode to see their fate because I was concentrating so hard on the main characters (and it was getting pretty late) that I forgot what became of them. It'll be interesting to see if anyone comes back to this series in the future in some form or fashion. Heck, even the cult show, The Prisoner, was picked up for a remake of sorts.

mayaXXX
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Mana: 
Well one theory that got around a bit back in the day regarding the demise of Kai, the Lexx etc, is that the old E-Vil things that still had the taint of His Divine Shadow had finally all been either destroyed or died off. The Divine Executioner, Mantrid, Brizon, all of the old HDS regime had finally fizzled out.

Even though we see Kai as a hero in the series, he's actually yet another remnant of that old regime, and he wants badly to reconnect with his spiritual self, that was lost when he was made a Divine Assassin. I think that is what his real torment was, not having his soul, and being denied spiritual awareness for so many thousands of years, and to be reunited with all of that was his goal.

darthomatic
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Adrift wrote:
I offer my own coiffure from a few years back as exhibit A and B... though admittedly deathhawks are probably more inspired by folks like Daniel Ash from Bauhaus or more specifically Johnny Slut of Specimen.




meanwhile .... downey DOES look like pinon.  despite having seen all of lexx and most of pinon's work, I needed you to point that out.

Haha. Well I'm glad someone else caught the resemblance. Every time I saw one or the other actor my mind flipped to the other. Its not just the look, but even the sort of spazzy acting style as well (though, I hate to say, I think Pinon is maybe the better actor, especially after having rewatched Delicatessen recently).


wowzers, that hair takes me right back to my very own misspent youth!.  I'm TOLD, but have yet to confirm, that at one point I had precisely that 'do, though mine was electric blue :c030a:.    I like your good lady's 'do, and all.  a touch of the '20's about it - very nice.  I'm currently trucking a louise brooks myself ... yee haww! 

but where were we?  oh yes, lexx ....

I think it's safe to say here, out loud, that pinon is ... ahem .... in a different league to our brian.  for starters, brian employs far more ham in his methode :cool:

darthomatic
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did someone mention bauhaus?

omg omg omg .... major flashbacks!

Adrift
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darthomatic wrote:
wowzers, that hair takes me right back to my very own misspent youth!.  I'm TOLD, but have yet to confirm, that at one point I had precisely that 'do, though mine was electric blue :c030a:.    I like your good lady's 'do, and all.  a touch of the '20's about it - very nice.  I'm currently trucking a louise brooks myself ... yee haww! 

but where were we?  oh yes, lexx ....

I think it's safe to say here, out loud, that pinon is ... ahem .... in a different league to our brian.  for starters, brian employs far more ham in his methode :cool:

:P It couldn't have been completely misspent if you had an electric blue mohawk! I added a touch of blue for awhile, but kept it mostly blue-black. I miss my mohawk, but probably wouldn't work out too well in the office. :D The lady friend is my ex-fiancee, she's always had great hair. Typically heavily influenced by Siouxsie Sioux (but I suppose that almost goes without saying).

About Brian/Pinon's acting methods, I think yours is a fair assessment, though Pinon hammed it up pretty nicely in City of Lost Children playing like a dozen versions of himself.

Oh, and yes, Bauhaus. Goth Rock royalty up there with The Cure, Siouxsie and the Banshees, Sisters of Mercy, and Christian Death. I got a chance to see them a few years ago for the first time when they were touring for their last album 'Go Away White'. Long story short, I spent a lot of money for the tickets only to get there so late that we only caught Bela Lugosi's Dead. :sigh: Daniel Ash still looked great (can't say the same for Peter Murphy).

Last edited on Mon Feb 21st, 2011 03:34 pm by Adrift

mayaXXX
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Ah the Goth goodies, takes me back, I listened to alot of Christian Death back in the day, but wasn't so much on the Cure, they felt alot more mainstream to me. I loved Lords of the New Church as well, Stiv Bators was the Man ! Of course, this was all before I got into black metal, hehe.

:2567:

Adrift
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Mana: 
mayaXXX wrote: Ah the Goth goodies, takes me back, I listened to alot of Christian Death back in the day, but wasn't so much on the Cure, they felt alot more mainstream to me. I loved Lords of the New Church as well, Stiv Bators was the Man ! Of course, this was all before I got into black metal, hehe.

:2567:

Rozz William's Christian Death was wonderful. Incredibly creative. They were really the archetype for a number of bands that came later, and don't get probably as much respect as they should have. Never got too into the later Valor Kand version of the band though. The Cure are a bit more mainstream especially the later stuff, but you should check out their early albums like Seventeen Seconds, Faith, and Pornography (Faith being my personal favorite). Quite a bit darker than the stuff that came out later, but if you're more into black metal now, it may not suit you.

You're right, Stiv Bators rocked, I love Lords of the New Church. I also really liked his previous band Rocket From the Tombs, which split and gave us the Dead Boys, and Pere Ubu. This is all Cleveland based punk stuff, and is pretty close to my current neck of those woods, though I grew up on the East Coast during a lot of this, and was probably too young to know about it anyways.

Kaden
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Oh, people after my musical heart. *sigh*

:c030a:

darthomatic
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Adrift wrote:
:P It couldn't have been completely misspent if you had an electric blue mohawk! I added a touch of blue for awhile, but kept it mostly blue-black. I miss my mohawk, but probably wouldn't work out too well in the office. :D The lady friend is my ex-fiancee, she's always had great hair. Typically heavily influenced by Siouxsie Sioux (but I suppose that almost goes without saying).

About Brian/Pinon's acting methods, I think yours is a fair assessment, though Pinon hammed it up pretty nicely in City of Lost Children playing like a dozen versions of himself.

Oh, and yes, Bauhaus. Goth Rock royalty up there with The Cure, Siouxsie and the Banshees, Sisters of Mercy, and Christian Death. I got a chance to see them a few years ago for the first time when they were touring for their last album 'Go Away White'. Long story short, I spent a lot of money for the tickets only to get there so late that we only caught Bela Lugosi's Dead. :sigh: Daniel Ash still looked great (can't say the same for Peter Murphy).

'bela lugosi's dead' .... sigh .... such memories :D

say, you ever see siouxsie and the banshees live?  awesome, just awesome.

how about the cure live?  they did some amazing shows, despite their late exploration of popland.  funny, I was listening to them this morning in my car ... turned it up so loud I quite forgot where I was heading :bounce_pinka:

Adrift
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Kaden wrote:
Oh, people after my musical heart. *sigh*

:c030a:


Great! Music is one of my favorite subjects. :D Not surprised to see folks who share similar music interests also having a love affair with Lexx.

Adrift
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darthomatic wrote:
'bela lugosi's dead' .... sigh .... such memories :D

:D

say, you ever see siouxsie and the banshees live?  awesome, just awesome.

I wish. But no, unfortunately not. I'm mad in love with Siouxsie.

how about the cure live?  they did some amazing shows, despite their late exploration of popland.  funny, I was listening to them this morning in my car ... turned it up so loud I quite forgot where I was heading :bounce_pinka:


hehe. They'll do that to you. Yeah, I saw The Cure once. I love The Cure, but I thought the show was a bit underwhelming. Bob just had no energy it seemed. He was kind of going by the numbers or something. The girl in my picture there is absolutely devoted to The Cure though and has seen them live countless times. I think I just saw a bad performance is all. :P

darthomatic
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absolutely. must have been a bad night for bob. early on he did incredible shows. he was completely insane and completely edible. lick lick.

darthomatic
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so you're crushie on ms sioux eh? she must be about 187 years old by now! still, I suppose we cling with vice-like grip to early images of our idols, rather than the middle-aged reality.

michael mcmanus being the glorious exception :p

Adrift
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darthomatic wrote:
absolutely. must have been a bad night for bob. early on he did incredible shows. he was completely insane and completely edible. lick lick.

Haha. Yeah, I got stuck with, what my ex-fiancée affectionately calls him, Fat Bob. Simon Gallup looked great though and was really into it.

so you're crushie on ms sioux eh? she must be about 187 years old by now! still, I suppose we cling with vice-like grip to early images of our idols, rather than the middle-aged reality.

lol. yeah, true. For what its worth, I think Siouxsie is still a babe for 187. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vV8UVusmMWc

michael mcmanus being the glorious exception :p

Of course, of course. :D

Kaden
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Mana: 
Adrift wrote: Kaden wrote:
Oh, people after my musical heart. *sigh*

:c030a:


Great! Music is one of my favorite subjects. :D Not surprised to see folks who share similar music interests also having a love affair with Lexx.


You are correct, sir. :P I love anything and everything that is, as I like to call it, askew. Both Lexx and goth music fit that quite nicely. Slightly macabre with a smidgen of whimsy. Two of my favorite things!

Love the deathhawk, by the way. :c030a:

Adrift
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Mana: 
Kaden wrote:You are correct, sir. :P I love anything and everything that is, as I like to call it, askew. Both Lexx and goth music fit that quite nicely. Slightly macabre with a smidgen of whimsy. Two of my favorite things!

Yep. Exactly. For me, the weirder the better. Macabre is fun too.

Love the deathhawk, by the way. :c030a:

:D Thanks. Wish I still had it. Someday, someday.

mayaXXX
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Mana: 
Adrift wrote: mayaXXX wrote: Ah the Goth goodies, takes me back, I listened to alot of Christian Death back in the day, but wasn't so much on the Cure, they felt alot more mainstream to me. I loved Lords of the New Church as well, Stiv Bators was the Man ! Of course, this was all before I got into black metal, hehe.

:2567:

Rozz William's Christian Death was wonderful. Incredibly creative. They were really the archetype for a number of bands that came later, and don't get probably as much respect as they should have. Never got too into the later Valor Kand version of the band though. The Cure are a bit more mainstream especially the later stuff, but you should check out their early albums like Seventeen Seconds, Faith, and Pornography (Faith being my personal favorite). Quite a bit darker than the stuff that came out later, but if you're more into black metal now, it may not suit you.

You're right, Stiv Bators rocked, I love Lords of the New Church. I also really liked his previous band Rocket From the Tombs, which split and gave us the Dead Boys, and Pere Ubu. This is all Cleveland based punk stuff, and is pretty close to my current neck of those woods, though I grew up on the East Coast during a lot of this, and was probably too young to know about it anyways.


Ah the Dead Boys, one of my faves. Back in the 80's I worked for a couple different record labels and Goth/Punk trend was very hot. My fave at the time was Johnny Thunders and even the New York Dolls, even though they were sort of glam, but they could rock a house. I still have some JT bootleg discs that have killer stuff on them. I saw him live in Memphis and he kicked ass. I liked Daniel Ash and Peter Murphy as well, but Dali's Car was a bigger fave and some of the other early trance/Goth groups as well. I had a Christian Death pic disc signed by Valor before he killed himself, but I have since sold that.

The Ska stuff is also killer, I loved English Beat, Dave Wakeling's solo stuff, Ranking Roger, Madness, Gang of Four, you name it. Pretty much anything that was on the 'Urgh a Music War' album was a fave of mine. Oh, also, the Cramps, big collector of their early stuff, since I worked for IRS-MCA at the time. I still have some rare CD and video stuff, including that live performance they did at the mental hospital..*wink*.

Adrift
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mayaXXX wrote: Ah the Dead Boys, one of my faves. Back in the 80's I worked for a couple different record labels and Goth/Punk trend was very hot. My fave at the time was Johnny Thunders and even the New York Dolls, even though they were sort of glam, but they could rock a house. I still have some JT bootleg discs that have killer stuff on them. I saw him live in Memphis and he kicked ass. I liked Daniel Ash and Peter Murphy as well, but Dali's Car was a bigger fave and some of the other early trance/Goth groups as well. I had a Christian Death pic disc signed by Valor before he killed himself, but I have since sold that.

The Ska stuff is also killer, I loved English Beat, Dave Wakeling's solo stuff, Ranking Roger, Madness, Gang of Four, you name it. Pretty much anything that was on the 'Urgh a Music War' album was a fave of mine. Oh, also, the Cramps, big collector of their early stuff, since I worked for IRS-MCA at the time. I still have some rare CD and video stuff, including that live performance they did at the mental hospital..*wink*.

Wow! Very cool. I'm a huge New York Dolls fan. Heck I love all of that pre or proto-punk glam, and experimental stuff. Suicide, Velvet Underground, Chrome, The Stooges, Bowie, Talking Heads, etc... But I could listen to the NY Dolls on repeat for days. Honestly I've never delved much into Johny Thunders later catalog... I really ought to. I mean, I've heard a little bit of the Hearbreakers stuff, but not that much really.

I have Dalis Car album someplace in a stack of albums at my parent's home. I haven't listened to it in awhile... I'll have to dig it out for a spin, and see if it grows on me.

I think you mean, before Rozz killed himself. Though I'm sure some fans wish he had, Valor is still very much alive as far as I know. Too bad you still don't have that pic disk... I'd think of buying it from you. :)

I like a lot of the ska stuff too. English Beat and Madness are faves, but I don't really know their discography very well. I adore early Gang of Four though. Entertainment! is probably one of my favoritist albums of all time. I'm also a big fan of the Cramps. Broke my heart when Lux Interior died... never got a chance to see them. I've seen that video of the mental hospital someplace. Might be on a tape or DVD I own... or maybe it was just a Youtube video... I can't remember. Pretty wild.

So do you still work in the music industry?

darthomatic
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you guys who like madness must have an opinion on the specials (I prefer the latter, by a goodly margin).  ?

omg ... the cramps!  this is turning out to be quite a ride :D

@adrift, checking out your youtube presently.  get back to you on 187 year old rock chicks :P

Last edited on Tue Feb 22nd, 2011 11:22 pm by darthomatic

Kaden
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Suicide! Good gravy, I haven't heard them mentioned in eons. Love Ghost Rider and Alan Vega is a trip. I'm fascinated by the music from that era, the whole No Wave thing. I've seen a couple of good documentaries about it. I love the idea of people living their art. I'm also a huge Bowie fan. And the Cramps and the Stooges... pretty much everyone you guys mentioned. :D Ooh, and the Clash. And X!!! Exene and John Doe had some, shall we say, unique harmonies, and I really dug her whole '20's vamp look.

 Excellent taste, people!

Adrift
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darthomatic wrote:
you guys who like madness must have an opinion on the specials (I prefer the latter, by a goodly margin).  ?

Yep, I dig the Specials too. Like those other 2 Tone ska bands, I'd probably be able to pick them out in a rotation of music, but I'm not real intimate with their catalog. I don't think I ever owned a Madness or a Specials ablum... I like that sound, its just not a genre I got much into with the exception of the later punk infused stuff like Operation Ivy. I'll have to pick up some of the early stuff though, I'm always looking for new (to me) music to listen to.

omg ... the cramps!  this is turning out to be quite a ride :D

hehe. Do you listen to any of this stuff anymore? If not, what are you into now?

@adrift, checking out your youtube presently.  get back to you on 187 year old rock chicks :P


Yeah, its not really the best quality video, but she's still got her figure. That song is off her latest solo album... I think it came out in 07. I haven't picked it up yet...
Siouxsie's still got sass too, apparently she was at some sort of party a few years ago... I think it was for Debbie Harry, and Paris Hilton plopped down next to her talking on her cell phone while people were making speeches, and reportedly Siouxsie says to her something like... "Turn off that #$@*% cell phone, you spoiled rotten little brat. This isn't about you." "Who invited this silly cow, anyway?"

Adrift
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Mana: 
Kaden wrote:
Suicide! Good gravy, I haven't heard them mentioned in eons. Love Ghost Rider and Alan Vega is a trip. I'm fascinated by the music from that era, the whole No Wave thing.

Yeah, me too. No Wave was a weird beast. Suicide was probably the first act in that genre (if you could call it a genre really) and probably the one I gravitate to the most. A lot of the other No Wave output is hit and miss for me. I'll listen to it for nostalgia or educational's sake, but some of it can be hard for me to really get into. Lydia Lunch's Teenage Jesus and the Jerks stuff is good, and I like the Contortions, and DNA, but outside of Suicide I probably don't listen to a whole lot of it. I wrote Nick Zedd, who made some bizarre No Wave films in that period a few times. I had some questions about some words he coined. Nice guy.

I've seen a couple of good documentaries about it.

Yeah, I saw one recently too. It had some modern bands in it. I did't really care about the modern stuff, but the history and interviews with the older artists were pretty awesome.

I love the idea of people living their art.

Absolutely. I always get jealous, and a little angry at myself for not being more creative when I see others doing it so well.

I'm also a huge Bowie fan. And the Cramps and the Stooges... pretty much everyone you guys mentioned. :D Ooh, and the Clash. And X!!! Exene and John Doe had some, shall we say, unique harmonies, and I really dug her whole '20's vamp look.

Yep, I love all of that stuff too. And the 20s stuff is very classy.

Excellent taste, people!

Likewise :D

mayaXXX
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Mana: 
Adrift wrote: mayaXXX wrote: .

Wow! Very cool. I'm a huge New York Dolls fan. Heck I love all of that pre or proto-punk glam, and experimental stuff. Suicide, Velvet Underground, Chrome, The Stooges, Bowie, Talking Heads, etc... But I could listen to the NY Dolls on repeat for days. Honestly I've never delved much into Johny Thunders later catalog... I really ought to. I mean, I've heard a little bit of the Hearbreakers stuff, but not that much really.

I have Dalis Car album someplace in a stack of albums at my parent's home. I haven't listened to it in awhile... I'll have to dig it out for a spin, and see if it grows on me.

I think you mean, before Rozz killed himself. Though I'm sure some fans wish he had, Valor is still very much alive as far as I know. Too bad you still don't have that pic disk... I'd think of buying it from you. :)

I like a lot of the ska stuff too. English Beat and Madness are faves, but I don't really know their discography very well. I adore early Gang of Four though. Entertainment! is probably one of my favoritist albums of all time. I'm also a big fan of the Cramps. Broke my heart when Lux Interior died... never got a chance to see them. I've seen that video of the mental hospital someplace. Might be on a tape or DVD I own... or maybe it was just a Youtube video... I can't remember. Pretty wild.

So do you still work in the music industry?


Wow, lots of folks here with great taste in music. Speaking of the Velvet Underground, I got a chance to interview John Cale at the Empire theater in Dallas back in the late 80's and he autographed all of my LPs that I brought and even signeds the VU bootleg box set of vinyl I'd brought to show him, since I heard he collected his own stuff. He was great, and VERY generousl

Not in the music industry any longer, 14 years was enough. :)

If you missed the Cramps, I have tons of photos I took of them onstage. It's such a shame about Lux, I had such a mad crush on him. He used to do 'special' poses onstage when I was filming, and would come down to the end of the stage I was at and made sure I got great shots. What a sweetheart.

After I get back from work tomorrow, I'll dig some pics out of my more fave concerts and post pics of them. In the meantime, visit my Facebook page since I have a bunch of pics of me with various musics acts, including Iggy Pop, and some other interesting people. It's listed as mayaxiong on FB.

I have some rare concert pics of Gary Numan, the Alarm, REM, Iggy Pop, the Cramps, and a bunch of metal bands from the late 80's to early 90's, like Megadeth and King Diamond.

Adrift
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Wow, lots of folks here with great taste in music. Speaking of the Velvet Underground, I got a chance to interview John Cale at the Empire theater in Dallas back in the late 80's and he autographed all of my LPs that I brought and even signeds the VU bootleg box set of vinyl I'd brought to show him, since I heard he collected his own stuff. He was great, and VERY generous

How cool! I so envy you.

Not in the music industry any longer, 14 years was enough. :)

Hehe. Fair enough. Sounds like you have plenty of stories though.

If you missed the Cramps, I have tons of photos I took of them onstage. It's such a shame about Lux, I had such a mad crush on him. He used to do 'special' poses onstage when I was filming, and would come down to the end of the stage I was at and made sure I got great shots. What a sweetheart.

After I get back from work tomorrow, I'll dig some pics out of my more fave concerts and post pics of them. In the meantime, visit my Facebook page since I have a bunch of pics of me with various musics acts, including Iggy Pop, and some other interesting people. It's listed as mayaxiong on FB.


Awesome! I'll check out the FB page, thank you!

Last edited on Wed Feb 23rd, 2011 01:39 pm by Adrift

darthomatic
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@ maya, any other place I can stalk your pics? I don't do facebook for political reasons, but would love to see you and the famous peeps hangin' :p

darthomatic
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@ adrift

one of the amusing facts of reaching 40 is that some of us spend far more time listening to music from yesterday than is good for us. ergo, yes, the old stuff on high rotation here. I have family members at the pointy end of the music industry though, and they have a habit of reminding me that the world still turns. keeps at least one toe in the now ;)

fwiw, my car's current cd stack ... mozart, tchaikovsky, the cure, the doors, system of a down, nick drake, xavier rudd, jazzy smith, metallica, massive attack, RATM, dungen, and gurrumul yunipingu. eclectic, you might say :cool:

Last edited on Wed Feb 23rd, 2011 10:01 pm by darthomatic

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@ adrift

just watched your siouxsie vid. she does look alright, doesn't she! immediately after that I watched the original "happy house" vid, by way of comparison. fun :p

speaking of punk, "the filth and the fury" was on free-to-air tv here last night. mysterious yet pleasing coincidence :)

Last edited on Wed Feb 23rd, 2011 10:51 pm by darthomatic

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darthomatic wrote:
@ adrift

one of the amusing facts of reaching 40 is that some of us spend far more time listening to music from yesterday than is good for us. ergo, yes, the old stuff on high rotation here. I have family members at the pointy end of the music industry though, and they have a habit of reminding me that the world still turns. keeps at least one toe in the now ;)


Well at 35, I'm not too far off then I guess. I rarely listen to new music... not unless its emulating old music most of the time. Not that I'm against listening to new music, there's just so much good old stuff I haven't heard yet that I'm still catching up.

fwiw, my car's current cd stack ... mozart, tchaikovsky, the cure, the doors, system of a down, nick drake, xavier rudd, jazzy smith, metallica, massive attack, RATM, dungen, and gurrumul yunipingu. eclectic, you might say :cool:

Nice mix, but you started to lose me with the guttural sounding bands towards the end. I imagine those are some sort of Swedish death or black metal bands or somethig. :P

I;m not sure if I have a current cd/mp3 mix. I listen to a lot of eclectic podcasts or I stream WFMU out of New Jersey which is an open format radio station that plays pretty bizzaro stuff. The list of genres I listen to the most are probably bebop and hard bop styled jazz, punk, pre and post punk, goth, deathrock... that sort of thing. Current music I have a lot of include a whole lot of 60s and 70s garage rock, Serge Gainsbourg, Nick Cave, The Beatles, Chet Baker, Sisters of Mercy, Swans... I've always a big fan of the Police, I love world music like Indian sitar and tabla stuff. A couple of genres I was experimenting with recently include 60s and 70s psychedelic folk, and dark and offbeat Country and Western music from the 40s to the 70s. I typically can't tolerate much country music, but this stuff can be really strange and interesting. It evokes that sort of grainy early 70s 8-track truck driver feel. Stuff like Porter Wagoner's The Rubber Room, Autry Inman's The Ballad of Two Brothers, and Homer and Jethro's I Crept into the Crypt and Cried. There's a nice compilation that came out with some of this stuff called Troubled Troubadors. Country music is obviously one of those genres you can't really talk someone into, so I'm not going to try, and there's a lot of the darker stuff that I don't like either, but there's some interesting gems. I get bored with music easily and I'm always chasing after the next sound I haven't heard yet.

Last edited on Wed Feb 23rd, 2011 10:59 pm by Adrift

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well you got the swedish right, but dungen are a sunshiny pop outfit!. not mainstream pop, but Good pop with a whiff of the late 60's.

wow wow wow .... garage rock, nick cave, chet baker - have all that stuff here. and another thing .... I LOVE country music. more precisely, I love bluegrass and your more obscure stuff. loathe and detest mainstream country (hiya garth!). dig indian music too, both traditional and contemporary. some of the new dance stuff coming out of india is fantastic. really clever and interesting.

but here's an oddity for you, having said all that. this morning I listened to the Twilight soundtrack in the car (conveniently forgot to mention that one). naturally, I sealed the windows and kept several car lengths betwixt mine the next, just in case fellow road users were soiled by my crappy musical emissions :D

Last edited on Thu Feb 24th, 2011 01:26 am by darthomatic

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Adrift wrote:  The list of genres I listen to the most are probably bebop and hard bop styled jazz, punk, pre and post punk, goth, deathrock... that sort of thing.
You know a true jazz fan when they call it bebop. :D Love, love, love John Coltrane and Thelonious Monk. Add classical to the list and that's almost exactly what I listen to. The closest I can get to country is Johnny Cash. Or maybe Rockabilly, like The Blasters. I absolutely detest country pop. The sound of it just makes me angry. It's this whole weird Pavlovian response thing, I guess.

Does anyone listen to The Fall? I first heard them at a Henry Rollins talking show and now I can't get enough. Two Librans is stuck in my head for days and days after listening to it.

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darthomatic wrote:
well you got the swedish right, but dungen are a sunshiny pop outfit!. not mainstream pop, but Good pop with a whiff of the late 60's.

Hmm. Sounds good.

wow wow wow .... garage rock, nick cave, chet baker - have all that stuff here. and another thing .... I LOVE country music. more precisely, I love bluegrass and your more obscure stuff. loathe and detest mainstream country (hiya garth!). dig indian music too, both traditional and contemporary. some of the new dance stuff coming out of india is fantastic. really clever and interesting.

Yeah, I like bluegrass too. I wouldn't even rate it as country really. I guess what got me into some of that weirder more obscure country is that, I lived in Montana for a couple of years, and heard a lot of Western music. Western music isn't really country, its more like Home on the Range and Hank Williams Sr. type stuff. I once picked up a The The album that was nothing but Hank William Sr. covers... I didn't like it then, but I bet I would now. As far as the Indian dance stuff, I listen to an Indian Electronica podcast, and though a lot of it is sort of same-y sounding it kind of makes me imagine what the night life might be like there. I really love it when East meets West like that. I have some Turkish Psychedelic Garage Rock and its just brilliant.

Wow, didn't even know this existed, but I just looked for a sample of one of the artists of that style I like a lot and found this video just now http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0gjwpMb-k8

but here's an oddity for you, having said all that. this morning I listened to the Twilight soundtrack in the car (conveniently forgot to mention that one). naturally, I sealed the windows and kept several car lengths betwixt mine the next, just in case fellow road users were soiled by my crappy musical emissions :D

Lol. that's great. You'll more than likely have teenage girls giving you a thumbs up. I wouldn't know the soundtrack if I heard it. I was dragged to the first film against my will, but don't remember much about the experience. I get the same feeling a lot when I'm driving around too though, so you're not alone. :)

Last edited on Thu Feb 24th, 2011 02:28 am by Adrift

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Kaden wrote:
You know a true jazz fan when they call it bebop. :D Love, love, love John Coltrane and Thelonious Monk.

:D Absolutely. I got into all of that when I went through my beatnik phase in high school. Read too much Kerouac, and reruns of Dobie Gillis or something.

Add classical to the list and that's almost exactly what I listen to.

I like classical, but I don't really listen to a whole lot of it intentionally. Anything after the 19th century I'm not so keen on either.

The closest I can get to country is Johnny Cash. Or maybe Rockabilly, like The Blasters. I absolutely detest country pop. The sound of it just makes me angry. It's this whole weird Pavlovian response thing, I guess.

Yeah, I think my new found interest in obscure dark country is based on loving Johnny Cash's sound. I think I just wanted to find more of the same. For something completely different you might want to check out 16 HP. Sort of alternative gothic country. Powerful stuff: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-vpAn15-vE


Does anyone listen to The Fall? I first heard them at a Henry Rollins talking show and now I can't get enough. Two Librans is stuck in my head for days and days after listening to it.


I've listened to them, but I don't remember what they sound like. Checking that track out now.

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Kaden wrote:
Does anyone listen to The Fall? I first heard them at a Henry Rollins talking show and now I can't get enough. Two Librans is stuck in my head for days and days after listening to it.

Wow, what an awesome song. Totally my thing. I'm surprised I hadn't heard it before. Now I gotta track down the album or something.

Haven't told you guys this yet, but... I like you people. Couldn't ask for much more than a forum with people who have great taste in sci-fi and music. :D

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This place is great, isn't it! I've never gotten to discuss this stuff before as I don't know anyone else who likes it. It kinda bites because everyone I know likes movies and music (pretty standard hobbies :D), they just don't like the same kind of movies and music as I do. The people I work with spend hours discussing the latest happenings on American Idol while I do my best to ignore them lest my brain should melt.

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Kaden wrote:
This place is great, isn't it! I've never gotten to discuss this stuff before as I don't know anyone else who likes it. It kinda bites because everyone I know likes movies and music (pretty standard hobbies :D), they just don't like the same kind of movies and music as I do. The people I work with spend hours discussing the latest happenings on American Idol while I do my best to ignore them lest my brain should melt.

I've been on a few cool forums where folks had a lot of things in common. Thing is... eventually people run out of things to talk about or the original members move on and a lot of the time that kills it right there. The new members are usually trouble... that sort of thing. I wonder if anyone studies the social psychology of message forums. :D

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Uh oh, someone was talking about Indian music. Angel and Ketana will tell you how many bands I've tried to turn them onto over the years. My faves are: Najma, L. Shakar (for his violin) N. Fateh Ali Khan, Talvin Singh, and my favorite Middle Easten artists are: George Abdo, Natcha Atlas with and without Transglobal Underground, Ofra Haza and Khaled. I also like B21, and some other Bhangra groups. I also LOVE the trancy stuff the UK turns out that has a Middle Eastern flavor, like Delerium, Collide and Conjure One. I'm also a HUGE fan of Krishna band Kula Shaker.

 Don't get me started guys, seriously, we could be here all day. I'm a musicologist that goes back to the 40's, so if I get into the groove, we may never get off this subject, hehe.

Oh and yes, I DO have some interesting stories, right Angel?

:BULLWHIP:


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mayaXXX wrote:

Uh oh, someone was talking about Indian music. Angel and Ketana will tell you how many bands I've tried to turn them onto over the years. My faves are: Najma, L. Shakar (for his violin) N. Fateh Ali Khan, Talvin Singh, and my favorite Middle Easten artists are: George Abdo, Natcha Atlas with and without Transglobal Underground, Ofra Haza and Khaled. I also like B21, and some other Bhangra groups. I also LOVE the trancy stuff the UK turns out that has a Middle Eastern flavor, like Delerium, Collide and Conjure One. I'm also a HUGE fan of Krishna band Kula Shaker.

 Don't get me started guys, seriously, we could be here all day. I'm a musicologist that goes back to the 40's, so if I get into the groove, we may never get off this subject, hehe.

Oh and yes, I DO have some interesting stories, right Angel?

:BULLWHIP:



To be honest, the only eastern artists I know that know by name in that list is Fateh Ali Khan and Transglobal Underground. This is sort of weird, I started this morning playing a podcast from Utah called Radio Cosmopolis which plays a variety of world music... the current episode of this podcast I queued up is a mix of middle eastern music sort of commemorating whats going on over there right now, as I was reading your post the host announced that the first song up was by Natcha Atlas :D

I haven't heard any of those EBM bands you mentioned for awhile, but I totally agree with you that its awesome when they dabble into eastern sounding stuff. I wish there was more of that out there. Bill Laswell had a project called Material that dabbled with it a lot, mixing dub, jazz, and traditional Indian music together.

I totally encourage you to talk more about it... let the thread completely derail :D Oh and your music industry stories... now you really got my interest. :D

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@ maya

love ofra haza and kula shaker!

often listen to kula shaker on long drives.  so trance-ish and grateful dead-ish :P

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Adrift wrote

Haven't told you guys this yet, but... I like you people. Couldn't ask for much more than a forum with people who have great taste in sci-fi and music. :D

 :)



Last edited on Thu Feb 24th, 2011 10:23 pm by darthomatic

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Adrift wrote: I've been on a few cool forums where folks had a lot of things in common. Thing is... eventually people run out of things to talk about or the original members move on and a lot of the time that kills it right there. The new members are usually trouble... that sort of thing. I wonder if anyone studies the social psychology of message forums. :D

it's a tricky business, I agree.  and there seems such a dirth of sentience in your average sci fi forum - which is counter intuitive IMHO, but there you are.

the nutjobs here register life signs on my tricorder, so I've stuck around to see how it plays out.  posting crap here and there and waiting for pics of mcmanus, silver fox style, to drop from maya's magic bag of magic stuff :cool:

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@ adrift. if you like 60's garage rock, you might like this ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BByF6nQHnMU

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One of the reasons I don't bother with much of the new sci-fi is that it's a lot of surface gloss with no substance. I'm a big seeker of 'the message' and most of the older sci-fi either had a message or was a commentary on the world.

Give me Wells or Verne any day over some of the stuff that's out there now! Although I admit to being guilty of waiting to see what falls out of Maya's bag of tricks too!:c030a:

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in unrelated news, it's time I got an avi!

now, if I can just figure out how to do it ...

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ahhh ... that's better !

where were we?

darthomatic
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Abby1964 wrote: One of the reasons I don't bother with much of the new sci-fi is that it's a lot of surface gloss with no substance. I'm a big seeker of 'the message' and most of the older sci-fi either had a message or was a commentary on the world.

no new trek for you then?

more new spock for me :bigsarc:

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darthomatic wrote:
Abby1964 wrote: One of the reasons I don't bother with much of the new sci-fi is that it's a lot of surface gloss with no substance. I'm a big seeker of 'the message' and most of the older sci-fi either had a message or was a commentary on the world.

no new trek for you then?

more new spock for me :bigsarc:


He's all yours. I like my Star Trek cheesy and campy complete with salt shaker 'medical' implements, and bad Shatner acting.:xgroupwave2:

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are you saying shatters is a dud actor?

:shock:


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darthomatic wrote:
@ adrift. if you like 60's garage rock, you might like this ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BByF6nQHnMU


I likes a lot! Bet they'd be a blast to see live.

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Abby1964 wrote:
One of the reasons I don't bother with much of the new sci-fi is that it's a lot of surface gloss with no substance. I'm a big seeker of 'the message' and most of the older sci-fi either had a message or was a commentary on the world.

Give me Wells or Verne any day over some of the stuff that's out there now! Although I admit to being guilty of waiting to see what falls out of Maya's bag of tricks too!:c030a:


I think I can relate to that. I stopped paying for cable, so I'm not really even aware of whats out there anymore (I get my tv fix from Hulu and Netflix pretty much now), but even when I did have cable I didn't watch a whole lot of modern sci-fi. A lot of it is sort of soap opera-y, and that's just not really my thing. I'm a big fan of sci-fi and fantasy stuff that's mind bending or semi-philosophical. Outer Limits, Twilight Zone, The Prisoner, Night Gallery, Star Trek, Twin Peaks, Tales from the Darkside, etc. so naturally I was totally into Lexx. I have to admit that since I've turned off cable and started just streaming Netflix I've started giving some series a second chance. I liked the first seasons of Lost and Heroes for instance. I made myself figure out what all the hoopla was about surrounding Battlestar Galactica finally (the first 2 seasons were pretty cool), and I'm currently catching back up on Farscape which I think is sort of like "what if Lexx sold out to a mainstream audience and was given a decent budget?". So yeah, there's some new stuff I can watch, but I'm on the look out for another Lexx type series.

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That's funny, I did the exact same thing, ditching cable. I'm almost through the last season of Farscape on Netflix. I never watched Lost, not sure if I want to start.

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I stopped watching TV when I quit the Police department. I average maybe 3 hours per week. I'm much happier watching some older less than popular out there sci-fi flick like Repo Man or THX-1138.

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Kaden wrote:
That's funny, I did the exact same thing, ditching cable. I'm almost through the last season of Farscape on Netflix. I never watched Lost, not sure if I want to start.

Meh, you're not really missing anything except frustration with each passing season. :D

But yeah, its sort of freeing not being tied to cable, isn't it.

Last edited on Fri Feb 25th, 2011 03:06 am by Adrift

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Abby1964 wrote:
I stopped watching TV when I quit the Police department. I average maybe 3 hours per week. I'm much happier watching some older less than popular out there sci-fi flick like Repo Man or THX-1138.

Well, films to me are a different beast altogether. A tv series is an investment in time because you get so caught up in it, but a film is something you can plop down and get through with a bucket of popcorn. My problem with sci-fi film is that I've seen EVERYTHING. I'm literally scraping the B-list bottom of the sci-fi and fantasy bucket on Netflix. My only reprieve comes with the occasional foreign film that finally finds its way here, but even that's getting rare.

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Adrift wrote: But yeah, its sort of freeing not being tied to cable, isn't it.
It is. I don't have to see another reality show ever again, even in passing. That makes me so happy! :c030a:

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Kaden wrote:
Adrift wrote:
It is. I don't have to see another reality show ever again, even in passing. That makes me so happy! :c030a:


LOL, you know what's funny to me is that I started to notice how much crap Ill watch if its just "on". Not because I want to watch it, but because it happens to be on the channel I flicked it too. How horrible is that? Its like having Stockholm Syndrome or something. You just get used to it being there, and after awhile you fool yourself into thinking you like it. The hardest thing for me to do is actually find something I want to intentionally watch now on Netflix and Hulu. I mean, there's a lot of content there, but do I really want to watch... I don't know... Swamp Loggers? No, I don't.

The other thing that gets me, is, I'm not a sports fan at all, and during Superbowl Sunday, people were looking forward to the commercials. I saw a Hulu commercial for the Superbowl commercials! I thought to myself... "wow, people are actually looking forward to a sales pitch!" I just couldn't believe it. I don't miss commercials at all.

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I concur. :D I find that actually having to search for things to watch makes my choices much more thoughtful.

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Adrift wrote:
Abby1964 wrote:
I stopped watching TV when I quit the Police department. I average maybe 3 hours per week. I'm much happier watching some older less than popular out there sci-fi flick like Repo Man or THX-1138.

Well, films to me are a different beast altogether. A tv series is an investment in time because you get so caught up in it, but a film is something you can plop down and get through with a bucket of popcorn. My problem with sci-fi film is that I've seen EVERYTHING. I'm literally scraping the B-list bottom of the sci-fi and fantasy bucket on Netflix. My only reprieve comes with the occasional foreign film that finally finds its way here, but even that's getting rare.


Exactly why I prefer a film, most TV shows are not worth the investment. And yes the barrel scraping is going on across the board. I've been looking east for my horror for a while now. I can deal with most of the Pang brothers films but I still love the one that turned me on to the Asian horror, Ju-on (The Grudge 1 & 2) in the US. My DVD is almost worn out.

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I never saw the original, but The Grudge seemed like perhaps the slowest movie ever. I kept waiting for something to happen and it never did.

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I loved it but when it was remade they split it into two movies Grudge 1 and 2. Sam Rami wanted to make the story chronologically linear. While he stayed pretty faithful to each section (Even going so far as to film in the exact same location), he put a lot of filler to lead the audience from point A to Point B.

Ju-on is not a Point A to B film, It jumps to M then backs up to F. Rami didn't think that western audiences would appreciate being dragged around like that.

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Abby1964 wrote:
Exactly why I prefer a film, most TV shows are not worth the investment.

Yeah, I agree with that sentiment for the most part. There have been exceptions, but typically series don't get much better than the first season. I assume that's because the creators don't seem to have any long term plot concepts beyond a first season.... Most are probably just happy to get their projects off the ground in the first place.

And yes the barrel scraping is going on across the board. I've been looking east for my horror for a while now. I can deal with most of the Pang brothers films but I still love the one that turned me on to the Asian horror, Ju-on (The Grudge 1 & 2) in the US. My DVD is almost worn out.

I saw both American Grudge films and I have to admit to being underwhelmed, and I've only seen the American version of Bangkok Dangerous which is barely worth mentioning. I've seen a lot of Asian films, and though many of them have innovative themes, I simply have a hard time connecting to them because quite a bit of Asian cinema seems to take Western concepts and influence and retranslates it for an Eastern audience. Had a lot of Asian film been created in the West originally, I'd probably write quite a bit it off as sensationalistic, silly, or cheesy. Its only because they're foreign that it seems that a lot of people give them the time of day. What annoys me about quite a bit of Asian cinema is the emotional, I don't know... dissonance? of primary players. I'm certain this is a cultural issue rather than lack of creative talent. These films originate in mostly collectivist type cultures where passion and romance are manifested in ways that seem detached to me, and as a Westerner I have a hard time empathizing with characters in Asian films. This is not always true, and I suppose if I thought hard enough I could come up with a handful of films where this doesn't seem to be the case, but for the most part this is how I feel when watching them. I don't fault anyone for this, its simply something lost in translation.

Lately I've been watching a lot of Scandinavian and German films. I also appreciate a lot of French films. I haven't seen many decent modern Italian films though they were major innovators during the 60s and 70s. I also appreciate the occasional English and Spanish film, but these seem far and few between anymore. Russia pops a good one out now and then. I'm not a fan of Bollywood song and dance type stuff which seems to be the majority of what's coming out of India. South Korea's output is impressive, and I'm always impressed how so much of it out rivals some of the best out of Hong Kong and Japan.

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Adrift wrote: I saw both American Grudge films and I have to admit to being underwhelmed, and I've only seen the American version of Bangkok Dangerous which is barely worth mentioning. I've seen a lot of Asian films, and though many of them have innovative themes, I simply have a hard time connecting to them because quite a bit of Asian cinema seems to take Western concepts and influence and retranslates it for an Eastern audience. Had a lot of Asian film been created in the West originally, I'd probably write quite a bit it off as sensationalistic, silly, or cheesy. Its only because they're foreign that it seems that a lot of people give them the time of day. What annoys me about quite a bit of Asian cinema is the emotional, I don't know... dissonance? of primary players. I'm certain this is a cultural issue rather than lack of creative talent. These films originate in mostly collectivist type cultures where passion and romance are manifested in ways that seem detached to me, and as a Westerner I have a hard time empathizing with characters in Asian films. This is not always true, and I suppose if I thought hard enough I could come up with a handful of films where this doesn't seem to be the case, but for the most part this is how I feel when watching them. I don't fault anyone for this, its simply something lost in translation.

Wow, very well put. Your observations make a lot of sense. I feel a disconnection to a lot of Asian films but couldn't really explain why. There are very few I have really liked (mainly old Kurosawa films), but there was a short film that I enjoyed called The Hand. It's in an anthology called Eros. Unfortunately the rest of the anthology is bland, but I found The Hand very romantic and moving in a strange, quiet way. It was very subdued yet deeply emotional, which I have not seen very often in Asian films.

I love foreign films. It's fascinating to see the different ways a subject can be dealt with. Where one culture might focus on the cerebral, another might focus on the sensual or the emotional. It's interesting. You can see films that basically deal with the same subjects and yet they're executed in vastly different ways.

I tend to gravitate towards smaller, independent films where the filmmakers get to tell the stories the way they want to instead of the way that will appeal to the broadest audience. Don't get me wrong, big budget blockbusters and be a lot of fun (though usually they blow :P) but I generally prefer something with deeper meaning.

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Kaden wrote:
Wow, very well put. Your observations make a lot of sense. I feel a disconnection to a lot of Asian films but couldn't really explain why. There are very few I have really liked (mainly old Kurosawa films)

Thank you. I think its important to know why or explain why you don't appreciate something on the level that someone else does. Its not enough to say "well that sucked". I can live with someone telling me what I enjoy sucks, as long as they give me a reason for why they think it sucks. And I'm not saying I think Asian cinema sucks, far from it, I just realize that I'm not typically the target audience. Kurosawa is something else though. His films evoke a timeless sense of honor and duty that I suppose is lost on the West, yet we can still identify with it based on handed down tales of chivalry. Also a lot of the reason we can identify with his films is because American cinema ripped him off and retranslated his films for Western audiences. Maybe that's what Raimi was trying to accomplish with the Grudge... ?

but there was a short film that I enjoyed called The Hand. It's in an anthology called Eros. Unfortunately the rest of the anthology is bland, but I found The Hand very romantic and moving in a strange, quiet way. It was very subdued yet deeply emotional, which I have not seen very often in Asian films.

Hmm... I'll have to see if I can find that someplace. On the total opposite end of the spectrum, I really dig Tetsuo the Iron Man because of its surrealistic nature. Maybe I only like it because it reminds me of some weird cross between Eraserhead and Stalker. I also find Takashi Miike films fascinating. I don't know that I like his films... its more like I study his films when I watch them. They're often so detached from anything I can identify with that its just captivating to see how someone can think that way.

I love foreign films. It's fascinating to see the different ways a subject can be dealt with. Where one culture might focus on the cerebral, another might focus on the sensual or the emotional. It's interesting. You can see films that basically deal with the same subjects and yet they're executed in vastly different ways.

You're so right about that. I hate to think what other nationalities think of America based on our blockbusters. :D

I tend to gravitate towards smaller, independent films where the filmmakers get to tell the stories the way they want to instead of the way that will appeal to the broadest audience. Don't get me wrong, big budget blockbusters and be a lot of fun (though usually they blow :P) but I generally prefer something with deeper meaning.

It took me a long time to relax and just enjoy a big dumb blockbuster for what it is. When I read critics like Roger Ebert, I imagine he's probably done the same thing in his career, otherwise you become hypercritical about everything. Ultimately I do lean towards films that have substance over spectacle. I think though, that a lot of indie films think they're smarter than they really are. That can be an issue for me. I enjoy films by directors like David Lynch because I think he realizes that in order to draw the audience in you still have to catch their eye with something.

Kaden
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Adrift wrote: I also find Takashi Miike films fascinating. I don't know that I like his films... its more like I study his films when I watch them. They're often so detached from anything I can identify with that its just captivating to see how someone can think that way.


Interest piqued. :) I'll have to check those out.

It took me a long time to relax and just enjoy a big dumb blockbuster for what it is. When I read critics like Roger Ebert, I imagine he's probably done the same thing in his career, otherwise you become hypercritical about everything. Ultimately I do lean towards films that have substance over spectacle. I think though, that a lot of indie films think they're smarter than they really are. That can be an issue for me. I enjoy films by directors like David Lynch because I think he realizes that in order to draw the audience in you still have to catch their eye with something.

Good point. It can be a real turn-off when something, or someone, takes themselves too seriously. I suppose what I meant is that I like it when a filmmaker has the ability or freedom to be honest. Without being too self-important, of course. :c030a:

Sometimes my brain needs a break though. Then I just want to look at something pretty and silly.

:bounce_pinka:


Abby1964
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I spent a year in Korea and got into a few Asian horror movies at the time. The culture is more reserved and yet more open at the same time. It's nothing to see two guys walking sown the street holding hands (It almost like two female teen BFF's it not a sexual thing) but on The other hand you won't see much 'affection shown between the sexes. So you are right it probably is a culture thing. Now for me American movies annoy me in that no story can be told without 'sex'. No matter the situation or the plot there's going to be sex, that is missing in most Asian films it seems that more energy is focused on the story instead of using the plot as a background for 'sex' part of the story

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I have mixed feelings about sex in films. I have no problem with it if it helps move the narrative along. But when it's gratuitous... bleh. On the other hand, it bugs me when the subject matter calls for it and the director or actors shy away from it. Too much or not enough can hurt the quality of a film. A good example is the Oliver Stone film Alexander. The main character was supposed to be bi-sexual. He and his lover have this moment in the camp before they're about to go into battle where they declare their love for each other. And then they hug. Platonically. Zero chemistry, zero heat. If that moment had been between a man and woman they would have kissed passionately. To me, it looked like the actors were afraid to commit to the moment. That vexed me to no end. Don't make a film about diverse sexuality if you're afraid of the content. Terrible film. One of the worst I've ever seen.

mayaXXX
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Mana: 
Abby1964 wrote: I spent a year in Korea and got into a few Asian horror movies at the time. The culture is more reserved and yet more open at the same time. It's nothing to see two guys walking sown the street holding hands (It almost like two female teen BFF's it not a sexual thing) but on The other hand you won't see much 'affection shown between the sexes. So you are right it probably is a culture thing. Now for me American movies annoy me in that no story can be told without 'sex'. No matter the situation or the plot there's going to be sex, that is missing in most Asian films it seems that more energy is focused on the story instead of using the plot as a background for 'sex' part of the story

Both myself and Cesare here on this board are HUGE Asian film fans, especially HK, Japanese and Korean flicks. Cesare has posted some amazing pics of the old-school HK stars on the 'Hot Hunks' thread over the past couple of years, amazing stuff.

Personally I'm a fan of the sword and sorcery type Asian film, but I also go for the 'Heroic Bloodshed' type of gangster flick and the action films. In the HK movies, there's alot of sex infused with action, more over the top than even the US films, they really knew how to push the boundaries. The Koreans know how to make a good horror film, since their perspective is so close to the Japanese, who are masters of good horror. I'm also a fan of the cyber-punk genre that Adrift was talking about, in Tetsuo Body Hammer, Pinocchio 964 and others.

If you want to see some truly bizarre horror, watch Thai movies, they are demented. One in particular is 'Boxers Omen', and you have to see it to beleive it.

 

Adrift
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Abby1964 wrote:
I spent a year in Korea and got into a few Asian horror movies at the time. The culture is more reserved and yet more open at the same time. It's nothing to see two guys walking sown the street holding hands (It almost like two female teen BFF's it not a sexual thing) but on The other hand you won't see much 'affection shown between the sexes. So you are right it probably is a culture thing. Now for me American movies annoy me in that no story can be told without 'sex'. No matter the situation or the plot there's going to be sex, that is missing in most Asian films it seems that more energy is focused on the story instead of using the plot as a background for 'sex' part of the story

Why were you in Korea? Were you stationed there in the military? Because I had a similar experience in the Airforce in Germany. Adult females often have no problem holding hands as they're walking about. Odd how Americans are so touchy feely, yet we get stranged out by things like that. Germans seem very reserved when it comes to newcomers, yet once they know you, you're like family.

Last edited on Sat Feb 26th, 2011 06:29 am by Adrift

Adrift
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Kaden wrote:
I have mixed feelings about sex in films. I have no problem with it if it helps move the narrative along. But when it's gratuitous... bleh. On the other hand, it bugs me when the subject matter calls for it and the director or actors shy away from it. Too much or not enough can hurt the quality of a film. A good example is the Oliver Stone film Alexander. The main character was supposed to be bi-sexual. He and his lover have this moment in the camp before they're about to go into battle where they declare their love for each other. And then they hug. Platonically. Zero chemistry, zero heat. If that moment had been between a man and woman they would have kissed passionately. To me, it looked like the actors were afraid to commit to the moment. That vexed me to no end. Don't make a film about diverse sexuality if you're afraid of the content. Terrible film. One of the worst I've ever seen.

I have to admit getting slightly uncomfortable about explicit love scenes, only because I empathize with the actors so strongly. If it doesn't feel genuine I second think my suspension of disbelief. Mostly it doesn't concern me too much, but there's a new crop of films like The Brown Bunny which features non-simulated sexual content that disturbs me on a level that I don't think film needs to go to. How far away from that sort of thing do we need to go before we get into non-simulated violence? There's a line that I think crosses between fiction and reality that maybe only documentary needs to cross. Its bad enough that people watch their local news and in their heads believe that they're detached just because its on TV. There's a potential danger there that I'm not comfortable with.

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mayaXXX wrote:
If you want to see some truly bizarre horror, watch Thai movies, they are demented. One in particular is 'Boxers Omen', and you have to see it to beleive it.

 


Now you've piqued my curiosity and I have to find that film :D

Abby1964
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Mana: 
Adrift wrote:
Abby1964 wrote:
I spent a year in Korea and got into a few Asian horror movies at the time. The culture is more reserved and yet more open at the same time. It's nothing to see two guys walking sown the street holding hands (It almost like two female teen BFF's it not a sexual thing) but on The other hand you won't see much 'affection shown between the sexes. So you are right it probably is a culture thing. Now for me American movies annoy me in that no story can be told without 'sex'. No matter the situation or the plot there's going to be sex, that is missing in most Asian films it seems that more energy is focused on the story instead of using the plot as a background for 'sex' part of the story

Why were you in Korea? Were you stationed there in the military? Because I had a similar experience in the Airforce in Germany. Adult females often have no problem holding hands as they're walking about. Odd how Americans are so touchy feely, yet we get stranged out by things like that. Germans seem very reserved when it comes to newcomers, yet once they know you, you're like family.


Yes 13 months at Yongsan. And I remember on the bus that took us from The airbase in Osan to Yonsan two things stick with me; the smell I was there before the 'cleaned up' for the Olympics, seeing guys walking along holding hands and jumping to the wrong conclusion but in a good way. I was marveling that the culture was so open and accepting of homosexuality. I soon learned that it was friendship thing and not a sex thing when I got out and started mixing with the locals.

I still remember the first movie I saw there in a little off post theater (All of the movies were dubbed in Korean with English subtitles) it was called Vampires from Happy Mountain (At least that was the English subtitle of the film). It was part of a double feature with 48 Hours. That was truly interesting Eddie Murphy and Nick Nolte were speaking Korean.

Abby1964
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Kaden wrote:
I have mixed feelings about sex in films. I have no problem with it if it helps move the narrative along. But when it's gratuitous... bleh. On the other hand, it bugs me when the subject matter calls for it and the director or actors shy away from it. Too much or not enough can hurt the quality of a film. A good example is the Oliver Stone film Alexander. The main character was supposed to be bi-sexual. He and his lover have this moment in the camp before they're about to go into battle where they declare their love for each other. And then they hug. Platonically. Zero chemistry, zero heat. If that moment had been between a man and woman they would have kissed passionately. To me, it looked like the actors were afraid to commit to the moment. That vexed me to no end. Don't make a film about diverse sexuality if you're afraid of the content. Terrible film. One of the worst I've ever seen.

I don't have a problem with sex as a 'logical' part of the story like In Terminator. The sex was needed for the sequels to progress. But lets be real, when something that badass is trying to kill you, you're not going to be thinking about getting laid. You are going to be concentrating on saving your ass.

That's the problem for me no matter what the story, what the situation, the characters are going to decide that survival takes a back seat to sex or the director is going to throw in T & A shots that have nothing to do with the storyline. I'm not saying that there can't be sexual tension among the characters, I'm saying not all movie characters have to be so weak willed that they have no control over their hormones.

Kaden
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mayaXXX wrote: Both myself and Cesare here on this board are HUGE Asian film fans, especially HK, Japanese and Korean flicks. Cesare has posted some amazing pics of the old-school HK stars on the 'Hot Hunks' thread over the past couple of years, amazing stuff.

Personally I'm a fan of the sword and sorcery type Asian film, but I also go for the 'Heroic Bloodshed' type of gangster flick and the action films. In the HK movies, there's alot of sex infused with action, more over the top than even the US films, they really knew how to push the boundaries. The Koreans know how to make a good horror film, since their perspective is so close to the Japanese, who are masters of good horror. I'm also a fan of the cyber-punk genre that Adrift was talking about, in Tetsuo Body Hammer, Pinocchio 964 and others.

If you want to see some truly bizarre horror, watch Thai movies, they are demented. One in particular is 'Boxers Omen', and you have to see it to beleive it.

 

Apparently I didn't give Asian films enough of a chance, because those sound nifty. I tried watching several a while ago and felt indifferent so I moved on. There's just so many good films to try and take in that a lot gets missed. Now that I have more information about them I can watch them again with a different 'eye', so to speak.

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Abby1964 wrote: I don't have a problem with sex as a 'logical' part of the story like In Terminator. The sex was needed for the sequels to progress. But lets be real, when something that badass is trying to kill you, you're not going to be thinking about getting laid. You are going to be concentrating on saving your ass.

That's the problem for me no matter what the story, what the situation, the characters are going to decide that survival takes a back seat to sex or the director is going to throw in T & A shots that have nothing to do with the storyline. I'm not saying that there can't be sexual tension among the characters, I'm saying not all movie characters have to be so weak willed that they have no control over their hormones.


Agreed. I so am NOT advocating sex in films for no reason. Because that's just... ewww. Gratuitous anything, be it sex or violence, is not my thing. There should be a reason for anything that happens in a story. That being said, if graphic violence or sex are required to tell the story properly, that's when I don't mind them. And if the filmmakers shy away in those moments it takes me out of the story just as much as when those things are not called for. Basically, I just want films that allow that 'suspension of disbelief', as Adrift put it.

Brown Bunny is a perfect example of graphic sex for no reason. It really had no place in the film and was there just to be shocking and to sell tickets. And that is not interesting to me. Abby is right in that it's really sexual tension, and not the sex itself, that usually makes the story. It seems like, too often, mediocre filmmakers think that throwing in naked bodies is an acceptable substitute for substance. To which I say ick.

Last edited on Sun Feb 27th, 2011 01:20 am by Kaden

mayaXXX
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The trick with Asian films is picking the right ones, there are some really crappy titles out there because they make them on a shoestring budget and in about 3 weeks.

If you like the old-school sword films, I recommend these:

1. Last Hurrah For Chivalry-early John Woo film with Damian Lau, incredible swordfighting scenes.

2. Duel to the Death-Chinese and Japanese swordmasters square off.

3. Samurai 1-2, -All Japanese Samurai flicks, lots of action. Also check out Sanjuro and Yojimbo.

4. 47 Ronin- Samurai flick and great.

5. Swordsman 1-2,- Lots of great HK stars like Jet Li, etc, choreographed by Yuen Woo Ping.

If you like the gangster-type films:

1. The Killer-John Woo and Chow Yun-Fat, this the film that put Chow Yun-Fat on the map in the US.

2. Bullet in the Head-Another CYF film, tons of action.

3. Tokyo Drifter and Branded to Kill-early Japanese Yakuza films, patterend after Sam Peckinpah type violence.

4. Dowtown Torpedoes-HK Heist caper with some amazing SFX.

5. Any Jackie Chan HK film made before 1995, when it all went to hell. His earlier HK stuff is legendary, and not like the bullshit we see now.

Old School martial arts:

1. One Armed Swordsman, Hitman in the Hand of Buddah, Shaolin Wooden Men, Wing Chun, Shaolin Temple,  or anything with the following guys: Jimmy Wang-Yu, Alexander Fu-Sheng, Wang-Jang Lee, Gordon Liu, Lau Kar Leung, or early Jet Li.

If you like Supernatural horror or action:

1. Bride with the White Hair-Brigitte Lin, legendary beauty of HK cinema.

2. Chinese  Ghost Story-another legendary HK film

3. Storm Riders-Ekin Cheng and Aaron Kwok, 2 HK pop stars act and they do a fine job, plus the film used 'bullet-style' photography before The Matrix.

4. Zu Warriors of the Magic Mountain-early Tsui Hark film, started the whole supernaturl trend, John Carpenter was said to  have actually ripped off sets, costumes and characters from this film for his 'Big Trouble in Little China' film.

5. Heroic Trio-the hottest 3 actresses in HK (Anita Mui, MIchelle Yeoh, and Maggie Cheung) duke it out with the bad guy, Anthony Wong.

6. All the 'Ring' or Ringu movies from Japan, way better than ours. Also, the original Grudge, Battle Royale, Onmyoji, or others that you may run across will be great.

There are other great titles, like Green Snake, 3 Swordsmen, Blade of Fury, Burning Paradise, Tai Chi Master, etc, that are killer, but these are my particular faves.

Have fun !!

mayaXXX
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Adrift wrote: mayaXXX wrote:
If you want to see some truly bizarre horror, watch Thai movies, they are demented. One in particular is 'Boxers Omen', and you have to see it to beleive it.

 


Now you've piqued my curiosity and I have to find that film :D

Good luck there, it's not available on DVD, but I do have a tape of it, I might be able to dupe it onto a dvd, but not sure how good the quality will be.

Abby1964
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I love the old style martial arts (Late 70's or earlier) two of my favorites are The Master of the Flying Guillotine and the Five Deadly Venoms.

I actually love-love-loved Kung Fu Hustle by Stephen Chow. Old style martial arts, gangsters and the supernatural all rolled into one and just totally turned into the butt of the joke.

Last edited on Sun Feb 27th, 2011 05:58 am by Abby1964

darthomatic
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wow, this thread is galloping!

tv hating (and why wouldn't you ... it's the motherlode of stupid), asian film appreciation, non-simulated rogering, etc.  so much meaty goodness :D

fwiw, I'm not partial to asian film, despite being 50% culturally aligned.  I do LOVE my euro flicks, though.  german primarily, and french.  actually watched "coco and igor" last night, speaking of the french product.  fucking gorgeous.  remote and sublime.  whoever made it is a genius (must google that one).

meanwhile, all that talk of sex on film had me thinking of the 'list'.  you know ... films in which the sex SHOULD have been simulated, but wasn't.  american commercial films, that is.  the least likely to involve actual sex.  naughty!

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@ adrift

glad you liked that youtube. and yes, they WERE awesome live. sadly, they're now defunct. before defuncting though, they toured the states a few times, as well as europe. they probably played near you :p

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A lot of great eastern films have been mentioned by Abbey and Maya (which is one of my nieces name by the way). There are some exemplary eastern films that have been made. Don't get me wrong about that, however, a lot of Eastern films I simply do not identify with as posted previously.

darthomatic
wow, this thread is galloping!

tv hating (and why wouldn't you ... it's the motherlode of stupid), asian film appreciation, non-simulated rogering, etc. so much meaty goodness

fwiw, I'm not partial to asian film, despite being 50% culturally aligned. I do LOVE my euro flicks, though. german primarily, and french. actually watched "coco and igor" last night, speaking of the french product. fucking gorgeous. remote and sublime. whoever made it is a genius (must google that one).

meanwhile, all that talk of sex on film had me thinking of the 'list'. you know ... films in which the sex SHOULD have been simulated, but wasn't. american commercial films, that is. the least likely to involve actual sex. naughty!

@ adrift

glad you liked that youtube. and yes, they WERE awesome live. sadly, they're now defunct. before defuncting though, they toured the states a few times, as well as europe. they probably played near you :p


haha, more to add to my list :D thanks!

Its too bad I missed Rocket Science. Totally my groove. I sort of slept through the whole Garage Rock revival scene. I mean, I was aware of the whole scene and dug it, but I was so caught up in old school post-punk that a lot of it passed me by. In 20 years those bands will be underground classics, no doubt.

Last edited on Wed Mar 2nd, 2011 01:38 am by Adrift

Jensau
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As "47 Ronin" is mentioned in this thread, just thought you may (or may not!) like to know that Keanu Reeves is playing the part of "KAI"(!!!!) in the upcoming 3D (yuck) remake of it.

Kaden
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Oh joy, another remake. And with Keanu no less (whoa!) Surfer Samurai... sure, makes sense. :wtflol::BigB:

(And isn't he Canadian? Why does he sound like a valley girl?)

Last edited on Wed Mar 2nd, 2011 03:30 pm by Kaden

darthomatic
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Adrift wrote: A lot of great eastern films have been mentioned by Abbey and Maya (which is one of my nieces name by the way). There are some exemplary eastern films that have been made. Don't get me wrong about that, however, a lot of Eastern films I simply do not identify with as posted previously.
haha, more to add to my list :D thanks!

Its too bad I missed Rocket Science. Totally my groove. I sort of slept through the whole Garage Rock revival scene. I mean, I was aware of the whole scene and dug it, but I was so caught up in old school post-punk that a lot of it passed me by. In 20 years those bands will be underground classics, no doubt.

I dig kurosawa, and there are one or two chinese directors I think are brilliant (zhuangzhuang's amazing 'dao ma zei'), some indians (eg nalin's gorgeous and vast 'valley of flowers'), but generally I'm happier with your euro stuff.

on rocket science, they moved on to other projects about 3 years ago.  the singer suffered an acquired brain injury and was in recovery and rehab for a looong time, so they pretty much had to call it a day.  in the meantime, they're already considered one of the best of their type to come out of this country.  which makes me very proud indeed ... :cool:

Last edited on Thu Mar 3rd, 2011 01:26 am by darthomatic



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